250 street scrambler

[amartina75]

First question tho, does anyone have an allen screw list for the engine lengths and quantity that they could post or pm to me?
As i stated this came as a large box of bits, all the engine was stripped and loosly assembled I cant find anyone in the uk that has an engine set can get them from the states by the time I pay postage and import duty it gets very expensive for an engine bolt set.
It would also save me the laborious task of trying and measuring each size I have fabed up a set of engine mount bolts by threading m8 stainless rod and welding a nut to one end then polishing out.

Sam Classic Ducati does have a bolt set available, http://www.classicducati.com/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=543
it is rather expensive in my opinion.

[Sam]

Sam Classic Ducati does have a bolt set available, http://www.classicducati.com/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=543
it is rather expensive in my opinion.

That must be a new addition I had looked on there before,unless I missed them.

[DewCatTea-Bob]

" does anyone have an allen screw list for the engine lengths and quantity that they could post "

____ How about these links to a couple eBay-listings ... http://www.ebay.com/itm/DUCATI-NARROWCA ... 3cce546b18
&
http://www.ebay.com/itm/DUCATI-BEVEL-SI ... 3cce4d1dfc
However, I really don't recommend fastener-kits like these !
Aluminum Allen-bolt/screws are a better match-fit, especially for the cyl.head !
So if ya have to source most all the Allen-fasteners for the motor, then it's probably a better purchase to acquire aluminum-fasteners.
__ Also, all the original-stock fastener-lengths for OHC.Duke-motors, are 2 to 10mm shorter than they ought to be !
All the threaded-holes in the motor-casings & cyl.head ought to be chased-clean with a 6x1mm-size blind-hole thread-tap,, so as to not-only clean-out the threads, but also thread the holes all the way to their bottoms so that longer screw-shafts can then be fully inserted.
Here's a link to a related thread-post (of 3 or 4 such past posts I've done), discussing associated details. ... viewtopic.php?f=3&t=105&p=906&#p906
__ Looking-after the good-care of all the motor's 6mm-threads is certainly another fairly important chore that should-not be left over-looked, especially those of the cylinder-head !
Another related thread-post... viewtopic.php?f=3&t=32&p=108&#p108


Hopeful-Cheers,
-Bob

[Jordan]

Handy to have a press brake in your garage!
You must be thinking of going into production, Sam. It would have taken longer to make the press tool than to just bend some lighter gauge stuff?

Jordan

[joe46ho]

I think this is what your looking for, these are factory sizes though, and as bob said a lot of them can and should be upgraded to longer bolts (especially the top two valve cover bolts on each valve cover, i use 20mm long instead of 16)

Shift Selector cover to case: 6mm x 1.0 x 30mm (Qty. 3)
6mm x 1.0 x 35mm (qty. 2)
6mm x 1.0 x 45mm (qty. 1)

Cylinder head to bevel driveshaft tunnel
6mm x 1.0 x 30mm (qty. 2)

Lower bevel flange to case
6mm x 1.0 x 20mm (qty. 2)

Case to case attaching bolts
8mm x 125mm long (hex bolt/nut/washers qty 2)
6mm x 1.0 x 40mm (qty. 1)
6mm x 1.0 x 25mm (qty. 3)

Clutch cover to case
6mm x 1.0 x 40mm (Qty. 5)
6mm x 1.0 x 50mm (qty. 3)

Oil pump/timing side cover
6mm x 1.0 x 70.5mm "Column Bolt" qty. 1
6mm x 1.0 x 61.5mm "column bolt" qty. 1
6mm x 1.0 x 45mm (qty. 2)
6mm x 1.0 x 30mm (qty. 3)

Valve covers, cam end support, and bevel cover-
6mm x 1.0 x 16mm (qty. 17)
This is the one I would really suggest against following, most of the stripped fasteners i see are in the cylinder head, and i would do as bob suggested (and as i do on every single engine i work on, not just ducati singles) and bottom tap every single hole then check the hole depth with a depth gauge or depth measuring side of a caliper, then install whatever size works...

Hope that helps, You really dont need any "bolt kits" I would buy it from your closest industrial fastener supplier if i was you, that way you can pick your fastener material, grade, plating if desired, etc... You will spend less money and get a better fit.

Joe

[DewCatTea-Bob]

" these are factory sizes "

____ Thanks for the great/detailed help Joe ! _ (As I-myself was not very-much caring to bother looking-up a parts-book to find all the stock fastener-lengths.)


" a lot of them can and should be upgraded to longer bolts (especially the top two valve cover bolts on each valve cover, i use 20mm long instead of 16) "

____ I also prefer to use 20mm-lengths at those four upper-locations but, there's then a chance of their thread-shafts becoming bottomed-out against the rocker-pins before the cover gets fully tighten-down...
To prevent that from happening, not only do ya need to employ the stock extra-thick valve-cover gaskets, (rather than mere sealer-paste),, ya also should include aluminum-washers* under THOSE four locations !
(* The four screw-hole locations above the rocker-pins are a source of oil-leakage [which the Allen-heads alone can't seal against], so the factory finally addressed that issue [on the later w-c.models], by adding suitably sized aluminum-washers for those four locations [only].)
Otherwise, 18mm-lengths are all the longer that will properly fit (in those four spots),
and 18mm-screws will fit ALL 17 cyl.head threaded-holes without any thread-tapping ! - (However WITH thread-tapping, all the other 13 fastener-holes will accept 25mm-lengths.)


____ I've added a pic showing the three main types of flat-nose thread-taps, and only the one shown at the far-right is suitable as a "blind-hole tap", as IT is the only type which will FULLY thread a hole all the way down to it's very-bottom (as needed) !
__ The four holes with a rocker-pin (unfortunately) located at their bottoms, are the only holes which won't benefit from such a thread-tap, (as THOSE holes are already threaded as far inward as possible).


Dukaddy-DUKEs,
-Bob

[Sam]

Handy to have a press brake in your garage!
You must be thinking of going into production, Sam. It would have taken longer to make the press tool than to just bend some lighter gauge stuff?

Jordan

Hi Jordan,

The tooling I used had been on the shelf for 12 yrs or so, I made a set of gates for my sister using a Rennie Mackintosh design. Just shows it pays not to throw anything out...!

[Sam]

Cheers Bob,
I cleaned out all the thread holes after bead blasting and had tapped them down to the bottom I used a machine tap which has a flat bottom, also noticed some were only tapped so far. I was amazed that all the threads were intact but suppose it would not have been tampered with as this has lay in a shed in Aberdeen since 1980 with a shot big end (date of registration November 1974).

Thank you for the list Joe,
I did try and go through the parts book online but it was making me sea sick with the pages flying through as I tried to flick to the next page.

[amartina75]

I think this is what your looking for, these are factory sizes though, and as bob said a lot of them can and should be upgraded to longer bolts (especially the top two valve cover bolts on each valve cover, i use 20mm long instead of 16)

Shift Selector cover to case: 6mm x 1.0 x 30mm (Qty. 3)
6mm x 1.0 x 35mm (qty. 2)
6mm x 1.0 x 45mm (qty. 1)

Cylinder head to bevel driveshaft tunnel
6mm x 1.0 x 30mm (qty. 2)

Lower bevel flange to case
6mm x 1.0 x 20mm (qty. 2)

Case to case attaching bolts
8mm x 125mm long (hex bolt/nut/washers qty 2)
6mm x 1.0 x 40mm (qty. 1)
6mm x 1.0 x 25mm (qty. 3)

Clutch cover to case
6mm x 1.0 x 40mm (Qty. 5)
6mm x 1.0 x 50mm (qty. 3)

Oil pump/timing side cover
6mm x 1.0 x 70.5mm "Column Bolt" qty. 1
6mm x 1.0 x 61.5mm "column bolt" qty. 1
6mm x 1.0 x 45mm (qty. 2)
6mm x 1.0 x 30mm (qty. 3)

Valve covers, cam end support, and bevel cover-
6mm x 1.0 x 16mm (qty. 17)
This is the one I would really suggest against following, most of the stripped fasteners i see are in the cylinder head, and i would do as bob suggested (and as i do on every single engine i work on, not just ducati singles) and bottom tap every single hole then check the hole depth with a depth gauge or depth measuring side of a caliper, then install whatever size works...

Hope that helps, You really dont need any "bolt kits" I would buy it from your closest industrial fastener supplier if i was you, that way you can pick your fastener material, grade, plating if desired, etc... You will spend less money and get a better fit.

Joe

This should be put in the Tech section so as to not be lost in a sea of other posts.

[DewCatTea-Bob]

By : Sam...
" I cleaned out all the thread holes after bead blasting "

____ Too-bad you hadn't read my 2009-post warning against that, and had to learn the hard-way ! _ Cuz then you could've avoided all the extra tedious clean-out work, and also, the removal-process of all the glass-dust & grit is certainly not beneficial to the condition of the threads !
__ I once had to clean-out all the threaded-holes in a crankcase after having been bead-blasted, and it was several hours of un-enjoyable work to get them cleaned to my satisfaction.
After repeatedly using the greased thread-tap method (to get-out all the fine particle-dust), I next used a thin-oil (like WD40) under high-pressure through a thin nozzle-tube to finish getting-out all the remaining final amounts of extra-fine dirty-dust.
__ Cleaning-out all the threaded-holes after a blast-cleaning is a job I'd never want to be faced with ever again !!
Everyone, please THINK to insert screws into the holes BEFORE blasting !



" had tapped them down to the bottom I used a machine tap which has a flat bottom, also noticed some were only tapped so far. "

____ So long as that tap's fat-tip was FULL-threaded, the holes should now accept longer thread-shafts...
As a rule, most holes can then accept an additional 10mm of fastener shaft-length, but the holes which include a case-cover locator/barrow-dowel, only accept 5mm additional length.


Dukaddy-DUKEs,
-Bob