160 lacking frame numbers

[IanA]

Hi,
I am about to buy a job lot of basket case 160's with 2 frames included but neither has frame numbers.
From research i read that in the USA that Berliner didn't have frame numbers and each state stamped up its own frame plate to suit its local needs. these frames allegedly were bought from a closing down ducati dealer in stockport, and should have been UK stock but might not be.

My question is about the NOVA and registration process. I could buy a plate and stamp it up to suit the engine number, basically what the USA did, but is this legal and/or correct. Not sure how else i can get a registration number or dating certificate.

Any advice gratefully received, Ian

[ranton_rambler]

I assume you’re in UK?
Are you sure there are no numbers hidden under paint? My 175 number was quite hard to see so when the SGS guy came to inspect on behalf of DVLA I had to rub a bit of black marker pen over to make it stand out.
Stamping a “plausible” number would probably work but you’ll need to get an accredited club to accept it and give you a dating letter. There is the slight danger that you pick a number that is already on DVLA computer.
From a similar thing on a Guzzi forum, I believe that DVLA will allocate a VIN but not sure if it gets a Q plate.
Ian

[Jon Pegler]

You can apply for a NOVA with HMRC using the engine number as vehicle identification.
You can also use the engine number as a means of getting a vehicle dating certificate. This can be obtained from a number of sources, DOC, VMCC etc..
When it comes to registering a vehicle at the DVLA, record the engine and frame numbers as being the same.
You may be informed by the DVLA that they require your vehicle to be inspected. This is currently carried out by a contractor.
The contractor will look at the engine and frame numbers to check that they match what it says on your application, as well as checking that the vehicle is complete. This is to stop fraudulent applicants attempting to obtain a registration document without actually having the complete machine. The contractor will also take a number of photographs of the vehicle itself, including the engine and frame numbers.
In order to have a frame number on your bike it will be necessary to purchase a blank vehicle identification sticker, as fitted to US bikes and stamp the numbers onto it. This will satisfy the contractor who may come and inspect your bike.
Your bike may not even be inspected, especially if you enclose photographs of the engine number and stamped frame number sticker with your DVLA application.
I have followed this course with a US imported 450RT and had no problems.

Jon

[Ventodue]

I am about to buy a job lot of basket case 160's with 2 frames included but neither has frame numbers. From research I read that in the USA that Berliner didn't have frame numbers and each state stamped up its own frame plate to suit its local needs. These frames allegedly were bought from a closing down Ducati dealer in Stockport, and should have been UK stock but might not be.

Two possible explanations, Ian:
1. The frames were part of the Hannah shipment, the one that Berliner refused and ended up in the UK. Mick Walker says there were 1,800 Monza Juniors in that shipment - and he would know, seeing as he bought most of what Hannah failed to shift.

That would explain the absence of a frame number.

2. Replacement frames were always supplied unstamped, the idea being that the dealer would stamp the frame with the same number of the (presumably crashed) frame that was being replaced. Otherwise, in jurisdictions that used a frame number as part of the registration process, the bike would have to be re-registered.

[IanA]

Great responses lad, much appreciated. Feel happy to progress, even though bikes incomplete, will build up sufficiently to convince an inspector.