diana blue

[bodge]

ive seen various threads about colour and the lechler codes but nothing so far about the diana mk 111 blue ,the advertising posters of the day seem to show a darker blue than that used on earlier models and most of the restorations but thats very subjective,other than a guy (dont remember which ducati forum) saying he had an original blue diana panel(didnt mention which model) and it wasnt metallic most seem to be done in metallic.

ive seen lots of photos of restored bikes in various shades most look metallic some didnt.

also people talking about kingfisher blue but no mention of that in the lechler codes,so im assuming this is the azzurro duc a22 (edit had written a23 which is beige) met which im guessing is the lighter blue used on a lot of the earlier bikes ? or is it correct for the mk 111

i took a punt and tried som duc a33 as it was the unly ducati blue i could get in a tin ,its certainly not mettalic and i think too dark but im no good with colours

20150625_141624.jpg

(this was just quicly blasted on so i could see the colour and not how the finished article will be)

was the diana blue darker than the earlier blue,mettalic or not?

[Eldert]

i have a NOS Diana tank . here is a picture :



Eldert

[bodge]

very nice eldert,looks metallic is it? any chance of a picture of the underside where the sun hasnt got to it ?
do you think this is the same blue as used on the mk 111 ?

[DewCatTea-Bob]

[quote= bodge ...
" looks metallic is it? "

____ Sure looks like actual/genuine metallic-type paint to me !
However I don't recall the original pre-63/4-speed 'Diana 250' -(not to be confused with a 'Mark-III' version) displaying any such obvious 'metallic' paint.
__ I hope the enhanced-pic.version I've included, helps. - (I've somewhat lightened-up the picture's darkness, while also slightly darkening it's light-brightness.)
If Eldert thinks I've inadvertently altered the paint's original tint/shade of blue, then hopefully he'll confirm so.
____ As for your-own picture showing the test-application of sample blue-paint,, that displayed blue-color strikes me as exhibiting a bit too much 'white-shading' mixed-in with the blue-tint, as I think it ought rather be shaded somewhat darker (towards 'navy-blue'). _ But certainly don't trust just my opinion alone, as I haven't laid-eyes on an original 'Diana' (with stock factory-paint still left untouched) since the late '60s !


Duke-Cheers,
-Bob

[bodge]

no, im very much interested in your opinion bob at least youve seen an original i certainly havent,im interested in the blue of the original mk 111 and also the stock diana.
from what you say do i take it that the stock diana (non mk111) blue wasnt a metallic?
ive seen restored mk 111's in a variety of shades and its just left me wondering.
eldert's original pic is the lighter blue ive come to associate more with the earlier bikes, youre corrected picture looks more like the colour often shown on mk 111 restoration and some period advertising ive seen although ive seen at least one mk 111 brochure that shows the mk 111 in the lighter blue as eldert's tank is.

by mk 111 i do mean the berliner 4 speed diana model with the scrambler mudguards/headlight uprated engine and no battery or toolboxes with the centrally mounted tacho.although i have found a period cycleworld article about the 64/65 5 speed diana mk 111 still with scrambler mudguards and no battery but with the more usual headlight and a side mounted tacho.

[DewCatTea-Bob]

[quote= bodge ...
" im very much interested in your opinion bob "

____ But my opinion would be merely just that,, and really not trustworthy, as I had never thought to pay much of any close attention to the specific concerns you're particularly interested in !



" im interested in the blue of the original mk 111 and also the stock diana. "

____ It's appreciated that you've confirmed so, as I had assumed it was just one or the other and wasn't really sure which Duke-model paint-color you were actually particularly most interested in.



" from what you say do i take it that the stock diana (non mk111) blue wasnt a metallic? "

____ I hadn't been steadfastly resolute about that detail because I really don't absolutely recall positively for-sure ! _ And besides,, I had never visited any Ducati-shop which had displayed a new 'Diana 250' model with it's fresh factory-paint, (prior to 1963).
But, from sometime between spring-63 & fall-65, I do recall friends & myself once being fairly impressed that the paint-finish on a brand-new showroom-display Duke-model's gas-tank was (by then) obviously a beautiful eye-catching 'metallic' (much like that of Eldert's tank),, and previous to that enlightening-occasion, I hadn't ever really noticed any such really-obvious silverish-particle metallic-finish on any older Duke-models before that time. _ (So that's a probable clue that a certain change had taken-place, concerning Ducati paint-finish.)
By comparison, the paint-finish on any older models (like the 'Diana 250' & '250 Monza') was-not really what's so much referred-to as genuine 'metallic',, but rather more-so a relatively powdery, more chalky-like/micro-particle* paint-finish, (* which similarly compares to genuine-metallic as like 'metallic' compares to 'metal-flake' -[metallic-like sparkle-FLAKES instead of sparkle-particles]). _ So just as 'metal-flake' finish is far more granularly-obvious to the eye than 'metallic' particle finish is,, conversely likewisely, the older/pre-metallic less granularly-obvious & more powder-ish looking paint-finish of the older models, sort-of appears somewhat similar to metallic-finish only when more closely 'eyeballed' (as if viewed through a focused magnifying-lens).
So it could be possible for someone to get-away with referring-to the older paint-finishes as 'metallic-paint' as well, (but such reference wouldn't be any more fair than referring-to actual-metallic as being 'metal-flake' !). _ However conversely,, the older micro-metallic paint-finishes could just as well also be considered as 'solid-color' paint, whenever compared to metal-flake or even std.metallic paint-finishes. _ So this possible interpretation-variance could possibly lead to miscommunications between 'solid' & 'metallic' paint-designations !
__ Hope you get what I mean to convey.
I thinking that most paint-restoration attempts by most others, haven't really thought to bother with making any practical distinction that makes certain note of the detailed-difference between true metallic-finish and the similar metallic-like but more powder-ish appearing micro-metallic paint-finish that was generally used by Ducati prior-to the (justifiably worthy) metallic-craze/fad that later fully-developed by the mid-60s (prior-to the custom-bike metalflake-craze beginning in the late-60s, [which Ducati had never adopted]).



" eldert's original pic is the lighter blue ive come to associate more with the earlier bikes, "

____ If you've been paying such close-attention for very long, then I'd well suspect that you're probably correct on that deduction.



" youre corrected picture looks more like the colour often shown on mk 111 restoration and some period advertising ive seen "

____ My altered pic.version is-not expected to be any 'correction' of any sort concerning the paint-colors ! _ As I merely brightened-up the darkness of the picture's original uneven shade-level and slightly dimmed-down the brightness of it's previously more uneven light-level, (and such shade/light-level compression really shouldn't have any coloring-effect on 'color' itself).
__ Ideally,, all pictures which intend to 'show' paint-color, really ought-to be taken only during mid-day with (non rain capable) overcast-clouding, (so as to provide bright omnidirectional lighting without any direct-sunlight !).



" although ive seen at least one mk 111 brochure that shows the mk 111 in the lighter blue as eldert's tank is. "

____ That Eldert's tank appears to sport true-metallic sparkle-finish, leads me to assume that his tank was factory-painted for a 1963 or newer 'Diana Mark III', (after the 'Diana 250' had become discontinued). _ (But still, I could be wrong,, cuz just because I don't recall ever seeing such beautiful true metallic-finish on a single used 'Diana 250', doesn't necessarily make it absolutely conclusive that such a paint-type was never factory-applied on any example of that Duke-model !)



" by mk 111 i do mean the berliner 4 speed diana model with the scrambler mudguards/headlight uprated engine and no battery or toolboxes with the centrally mounted tacho. "

____ That's indeed the original/first-edition of the 'Diana Mark III' model (that was little-more than a '250 Motocross' model with street-frame and higher-comp.piston plus the 'red-cam' camshaft-model).
__ Unfortunately I've never seen what one of those particular model's original-paint looked like.



____ I've tweaked-up the pic.shot of your tank paint-color picture,, and not-only does it appear to not show a std.type metallic-finish, but that paint also doesn't seem to be the extra-fine powder-metallic for-sure either. _ However, presented in-person,, you then ought be able to better tell-so, (as your digital-pic may-not be able to properly reflect the actual finish-consistency with any extra-fine metallic-like powder-particles left distinctly visible).


Hopeful-Cheers,
DCT-Bob

[Eldert]

my friend André is also putting a 62 4 speed Diana together . i loaned him some nos blue struts ( the ones to replace the rear shocks ) to see if we can get a color match but the surface was to small

see if we can take the correct color from the tank

Eldert

[bodge]

the paint i got is fairly obviously wrong for this model,the main reason for getting it was that it was the only ducati blue i could find in an aerosol.
the company i got it from (linked from this site)lists several ducati metallic blues.
im assuming that the ones prefixed "A" are the period ones several of these have the suffix "mica" as opposed to "met" and im wondering if this denotes the particulate size as bob referes to?

http://www.autopaint-pro.co.uk/500ml-du ... 1235-p.asp.

towards the bottom of the list are all the "A" prefixed colours, to my understanding the classic colours.
there seem to be several blues (as allready stated im not good with colour and to me unless their obviously green turquois and azzure are blue)guessing from the google translations although heaven/sky could refer to the night sky i think thats fairly unlikly

duc a7 turchese metallizzato met (turquoise)
duc a22 azzurro metallizzato met (azure)
duc a31 celeste metallizzato met (heavenly)
duc a32 metallizzato mica bleu
duc a34 bleu cielo metallizzato met (heaven/sky)

ive spoken to a very helpful guy and although they dont have colour swatches for all these hes going to email me the ones he has if he gets a chance,he also mentioned that the duc a34 needs applying over a metalized silver basecoat so i think this maybe a translucant tint ive seen spoken about elsewhere if he sends me the swatches ill post them.

[amartina75]

did you see this list of paint codes for Ducati motorcycles? http://www.lechler.eu/DesktopModules/Bring2mind/DMX/download.aspx?Command=Core_Download&EntryId=42884

maybe you can cross reference the color you want with what other bikes would have been available in that color. it looks like the A22 AZZURRO MET (light blue metallic) was the most common blue for the late 50's early 60's bikes.

also the A7 TURCHESE MET you mentioned doesn't show up until the '73 750SS (which I think is the "green frame" color

[bodge]

yes ive seen those i think i got the link for the supplier from one of your posts,if so thanks.funnily enough ive spent most of today looking for matches from the listed models,youre right about the a7 its very green .ive found these two references for a22

85 sport a22.jpg

ducati-350-gtl-03.jpg

non of the codes seem to come up with anything as light as eldert's tank