Identificación marco Scrambler

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elmoi11
Posts: 43
Joined: Thu Dec 05, 2019 1:21 am

Identificación marco Scrambler

Postby elmoi11 » Sat Oct 16, 2021 2:20 pm

Hello to all.
I have bought a chassis that I think is a Ducati 250 Scrambler, maybe from 74/75.
Can you help me, I would like to know for sure which model it belongs to.

It has a stamping on it.
D.M.250.S.256XXX
D.G.M.7935.O.M

Thank you.
Moisés
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IMG-20211013-WA0002.jpg

Ventodue
Posts: 821
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 3:23 pm
Location: Montpellier, France

Re: Identificación marco Scrambler

Postby Ventodue » Sat Oct 16, 2021 4:42 pm

elmoi11 wrote:Hello to all.
I have bought a chassis that I think is a Ducati 250 Scrambler, maybe from 74/75.
Can you help me, I would like to know for sure which model it belongs to.

It has a stamping on it.
D.M.250.S.256XXX
D.G.M.7935.O.M

A little complicated this one, Moisés ...

1. The easy bit first:
A frame stamped '250S' with homologation '7935' is definitely later than 27 April 1970. Why? Because this is the date that the certificate for the 250SCR frame was issued.

2. Ian Falloon says that from 1973 the frames were numbered from 252000, but adds that only 512 bikes were made until they ceased production in 1975. Now, if we assume that the frames were numbered in strict sequence, that means the latest number should be around 252512. Which makes your 256*** number a bit strange ...

BUT
3. The records on Bevel Heaven suggest that the frame numbering was not strictly sequenced. (I should say, the records for the 250cc bikes are the WORST of all the records there ...). There are these 4 records which disprove the idea of a strict sequencing:
252862
254411
255294
255435.

The last of these, 255435 is undated; and annoyingly 255294 is erroneously dated as 1970 :x . But 254411 is dated as 1974. And 252862 is dated as 1975.

So that is a very long way of saying that I think you're most probably right: you have the frame from a 1974-5 250 SCR!

Jon Pegler
Posts: 417
Joined: Sun May 16, 2010 6:19 pm

Re: Identificación marco Scrambler

Postby Jon Pegler » Sat Oct 16, 2021 5:26 pm

I would say that your frame is from a 1974 250 Scrambler, built in Spain for the export market- i.e for sale outside Spain.
Mototrans had two different numbering systems for Scramblers, depending on whether they would be sold in Spain, or sent to Bologna for sale around the world.
The frame in the photo has the small bars welded to the end of the swinging arm to allow for the snail cam rear wheel adjusters, indicating a Spanish built frame.
The seat bracket and the top shock absorber mounts indicate a Scrambler frame.
The numbers that start DM250S 256... would be a very late one to be produced.
I once had a late Scrambler with a 255... frame number and a 116... engine number, built in 1974.
Most of the late Spanish Scramblers had engine numbers that started 114, 115 or 116. Any 250 motor with a number series starting with one of these numbers would be a Mototrans motor.

Jon

elmoi11
Posts: 43
Joined: Thu Dec 05, 2019 1:21 am

Re: Identificación marco Scrambler

Postby elmoi11 » Sat Oct 16, 2021 5:57 pm

Thank you Jon and Ventodue.

Yes, I bought it in Spain, but the DM250S die-cutting caught my attention.

So we can say for sure that it was manufactured in Spain in 1974, for export to another country (pretending that it was manufactured in Bologna, that's why they die-cut it DM).

With this chassis number, I can't find any record of "traffic report" in Spain, so it seems logical that it was manufactured for export.

So I wonder if the homologation number 7935, which is stamped on it, would serve as proof of its authenticity, in order to be able to document it in Spain.

Thank you.
Moisés.

A.I.M
Posts: 41
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2020 3:39 pm
Location: Pyrenees-Orientales, France

Re: Identificación marco Scrambler

Postby A.I.M » Sat Oct 16, 2021 8:01 pm

If it helps at all, my 250 Mototrans Scrambler has:
Frame No. DM.250.S.255522
Frame Homologation No. D.G.M 7935.O.M
Engine No. 116477
Original UK Registration date not precisely known but certainly between August 1974 – July 1975. From this I suspect it was built late 1973 or early 1974.

Regards,
Al

elmoi11
Posts: 43
Joined: Thu Dec 05, 2019 1:21 am

Re: Identificación marco Scrambler

Postby elmoi11 » Sat Oct 16, 2021 8:55 pm

Thank you Al.

I still need to know if the DGM homologation of the chassis is valid for documenting the bike.

Mine has no documentation.

Thanks Al.
Moises.

A.I.M
Posts: 41
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2020 3:39 pm
Location: Pyrenees-Orientales, France

Re: Identificación marco Scrambler

Postby A.I.M » Sun Oct 17, 2021 6:04 am

I think the answer will be very specific to your country. I think you are in Spain? There may be some kind of association or authorised specialist that can certify for you, is there something like a Federacion Espanola de Vehículos Antiguos? Perhaps Jesus Guzman (recambiousado.com) can advise you?
Good luck,
Al

elmoi11
Posts: 43
Joined: Thu Dec 05, 2019 1:21 am

Re: Identificación marco Scrambler

Postby elmoi11 » Sun Oct 17, 2021 7:44 am

Thanks Al.

I will look into it in Spain.

Regards.
Moises.

Ventodue
Posts: 821
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 3:23 pm
Location: Montpellier, France

Re: Identificación marco Scrambler

Postby Ventodue » Sun Oct 17, 2021 9:50 am

Jon Pegler wrote: Mototrans had two different numbering systems for Scramblers, depending on whether they would be sold in Spain, or sent to Bologna for sale around the world.

Was that for both the frame and engine numbers, do you know, Jon?

Jon Pegler wrote:The frame in the photo has the small bars welded to the end of the swinging arm to allow for the snail cam rear wheel adjusters, indicating a Spanish built frame.

Ah! Yes. That's a nice detail to note and remember, Jon. Ta.

Jon Pegler wrote:Most of the late Spanish Scramblers had engine numbers that started 114, 115 or 116. Any 250 motor with a number series starting with one of these numbers would be a Mototrans motor.

(Just to confirm what Jon says) Ian Faloon has the Mototrans engine number sequence starting 114001. The Bevel Heaven records have 9 bikes with 114 numbers, 2 with 115s and 2 with 116s (Correction: 3, with Al's added :) )
Last edited by Ventodue on Sun Oct 17, 2021 9:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

Ventodue
Posts: 821
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 3:23 pm
Location: Montpellier, France

Re: Identificación marco Scrambler

Postby Ventodue » Sun Oct 17, 2021 9:58 am

A.I.M wrote:If it helps at all, my 250 Mototrans Scrambler has:
Frame No. DM.250.S.255522 <snip>

Send the details to Robert Miller (robertmiller@optusnet.com.au), will you please, Al?

At least we can be confident you'll get the details correct ... :)


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