380 cc Ducati racer

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double diamond
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Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2011 1:20 am

Re: 380 cc Ducati racer

Postby double diamond » Sun May 02, 2021 5:34 pm

Probably some condensation inside the engine if it sat idle for many years. Oil alone wouldn’t coagulate like that. The other possibility is that it was run on castor oil which would probably leave a mess after sitting for years

LaceyDucati
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Re: 380 cc Ducati racer

Postby LaceyDucati » Sun May 02, 2021 6:02 pm

Hello Bill

The dry clutch is basically a Nova item apart from having the names cast in it. Pat may have been the initial instigator of the Nova dry clutch, hence the cast in name. Later Nova dry clutches were identical less the names. The cover is Magnesium and Matt is correct in it is thick and heavy, the whole assembly is considerably heavier than a wet clutch set up. (just edited that as a bit seemed to have gone missing)

Dry clutches are an advantage for push starts,as it makes the bike significantly easier to push, like having the bike in neutral. However with clutch starts the norm nowadays, they can be nasty and snatchy off the line compared to a wet clutch set up. Wet clutches are also prone to oil leaks as the speed at the seal is high. There is also the slight issue that ducati bearing positioning is a bit variable, which means alignment of the seal to the gearbox shaft is sometimes less than perfect. With the Nova clutch there was also an amusing oversight with the seal used which is a Yamaha item which is directional......you've guessed it, the ducati clutch rotates in the other direction to the Yamaha :-) Unfortunately Pat was an ideas man, but the execution often left a little to be desired, often style over substance.

If it's not condensation, maybe the congealed oil is a mix of Castrol R and mineral oil. They don't mix and maybe someones has changed the oil not knowing what was in it.

The Nova gearbox parts I have don't include the six speed parts as these were specific to Staccato. The ident drum has an extra pin and dimple and is much the same as other 6 speed conversions that have been made. Enjoy the project and the unpicking...

Regards Nigel
Last edited by LaceyDucati on Mon May 03, 2021 8:32 am, edited 1 time in total.

double diamond
Posts: 555
Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2011 1:20 am

Re: 380 cc Ducati racer

Postby double diamond » Mon May 03, 2021 4:30 am

Bill,

Looks like you may be out in the cold if you need parts for your Staccato transmission. Have a look at motogears.cz. The pictures on the website certainly look impressive but I have no experience with their work. Might be a resource for you at some point.

Matt

themoudie
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Location: Scotland

Re: 380 cc Ducati racer

Postby themoudie » Mon May 03, 2021 8:21 am

Morning Bill,

Not sure if you have preferred engineer/machinist in your neck of the woods? Have some over here in Perthshire/Angus, if needs be. However, the hourly rates are no cheap! But, then skilled folk never were.

Hope the magnesium bits are salvageable, but not sure if they will be up for being "used"? I'm no metallurgist! ;)

Good health, Bill

Briobill
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Location: Bishopton , Scotland

Re: 380 cc Ducati racer

Postby Briobill » Mon May 03, 2021 11:16 am

Hi Matt, Nigel and Bill, Thanks for your comments.

All the gears in the five speed side of the casing are ok, it's the sixth gear pinion and the large primary gear that have been rubbing together, and causing the wear on the faces of both.
When I removed the clutch basket , there was a brass washer between it and the large primary gear.
Do you think there should be a washer or a shim between the back of the primary gear and the sixth gear pinion?
This would stop them from running face to face.
The teeth are ok on both gears , so i suppose that they would run ok with a bit of a honing / lapping on the faces.
This bike is not going to be raced again (not by me anyway ) and i got it just as an interesting retirement project , with the view to taking it to exhibit at some local classic bike shows , so if I can get it running that will be a bonus ( although with that straight through pipe , i don't think that the neighbours will be very pleased if I ever do get it running )
When I first got the bike, and looked it over, I thought about just giving it a good clean to get rid of the dirt and grime , and leaving it as it was with all the original lock wiring etc in place, but then decided to give it a total engine strip to see what I had..
Bill - I am hoping to engineer my way round this , and hopefully not have to remanufacture if I can help it , other than smaller items like shims , snap rings, bearings etc. which I am sure that Nigel will be able to help with.
The magnesium? Dry clutch cover cleaned up fine. No damage.
Regards
Bill.
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LaceyDucati
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Re: 380 cc Ducati racer

Postby LaceyDucati » Mon May 03, 2021 12:41 pm

Hello Bill

The bronze washer/spacer is a standard part of the Nova dry clutch, which rubs against a stepped spacer with oil slots in it. This I guess is not present with the Staccato modification. The 6 speed gears don't look like anything Nova would have made, the word rough comes to mind....At the worst of times they would never have produced anything like that. John Wittman used one of those conversions in his last few years of racing, so I guess they must have worked/functioned.

Regards Nigel

Briobill
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2021 1:24 pm
Location: Bishopton , Scotland

Re: 380 cc Ducati racer

Postby Briobill » Mon May 03, 2021 2:12 pm

Hello all
I would like to thank everyone who has replied to my request for information about the bike , and previous owner.
The details supplied have been very helpful .
Looks like the Staccato six gear modification is pretty rare , so not much information available.
Anyway i will continue with the engine disassembly and if I should come across any other problems , or queries that I need an answer to, I'm sure that I will be able to get help from the forum members.

Bill.

themoudie
Posts: 649
Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2014 12:44 am
Location: Scotland

Re: 380 cc Ducati racer

Postby themoudie » Mon May 10, 2021 10:33 pm

Aye Bill,

Please read your personal messages on this forum.

Would you also PM me about further personal background details concerning this thread?

Thank you.

Bill (up the road) ;)


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