450 so far

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MotoMike
Posts: 487
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2010 3:40 am

450 so far

Postby MotoMike » Mon Aug 16, 2010 1:39 pm

here are a few pics. still a long way to go, but I can ride it now. we'll see how it goes and maybe in the winter I can get more serious.

Image

Image

Image


thanks for looking
Mike
Last edited by MotoMike on Mon Aug 16, 2010 4:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

MotoMike
Posts: 487
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2010 3:40 am

Re: 450 so far

Postby MotoMike » Wed Sep 01, 2010 2:41 pm

So do you think it was a scrambler or just a scrambler frame?

Teckhardt
Posts: 394
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2009 10:25 pm
Location: Pacifc Northwet USA

Re: 450 so far

Postby Teckhardt » Wed Sep 01, 2010 5:40 pm

Looks dang good Mike. At least you can ride your 450 :evil: Everytime I work on mine, I find something else that needs fixing before I can ride. Oh well, its more about the project anyway or I would have bought a new Honda. :lol:

IMHO, I think it started life as a scrambler (SCR). The frame is looks like SCR and not a mototrans or road frame. Gauge holders, headlight, handlebars and tank are all like my 450SCR. The forks and the rear shocks are not SCR - mine have gaiters not shrouds. Front wheel looks like an 18" not a SCR 19". Front fender is different so is rear. Rocker style shift lever is not 450SCR. There are also a few aftermarket parts like the seat, pipe and tail light.

At the end of the day, unless you are going for a restoration, who cares. (Sure I will get flamed for that) Build it the way you like it.
1970 450 SCR

Teckhardt
Posts: 394
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2009 10:25 pm
Location: Pacifc Northwet USA

Re: 450 so far

Postby Teckhardt » Wed Sep 01, 2010 6:19 pm

Mike, I would be curious to know if your bike has some of the special 450 items.

The frame has bracing along the backbone tube and then down the side tubes. Looks like it does in the photo but hard to tell.

The swingarm has bracing along the bottom side.

The rear cush drive has two bearings pressed in. Other models have one bearing held in by a c clip and then a rubber seal on the outsided. (just figured this one out the other night)

Front brake hub has 12 reinforcement rays vs 6 for the other size bikes.

Image
1970 450 SCR

MotoMike
Posts: 487
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2010 3:40 am

Re: 450 so far

Postby MotoMike » Wed Sep 01, 2010 6:57 pm

Teckhardt wrote:
At the end of the day, unless you are going for a restoration, who cares. (Sure I will get flamed for that) Build it the way you like it.


thanks Teckhard
wondered it I was commiting some sort of blasphemy not returning it to scrambler dress, but I like the road bikes better. If I could find a MK3 seat, I'd put that on to see how it worked out.

DewCatTea-Bob
Posts: 2897
Joined: Sun Nov 01, 2009 10:53 am
Location: Near SE side of Lake Michigan

Re: 450 so far

Postby DewCatTea-Bob » Wed Sep 01, 2010 11:31 pm

" wondered it I was commiting some sort of blasphemy not returning it to scrambler dress, "

____ As far as DUKE-owners not returning DUKEs back to their original stock-dressing goes, there are probably very few who are more guilty (quantity wise) than I, of doing that !
That was my main driving-force... to create alternate model-styles that Ducati never did, but which I thought they ought to have.
__ In this case, while I do like the side-covers and do not dislike the tank, I really don't find those two separate styles to go very well together but, it's still a neat-alteration which helps make that DUKE Mike's very own.


" If I could find a MK3 seat, I'd put that on to see how it worked out. "

____ Did any other seat -(other than that which is seen in your pix), come with your 450?
__ I couldn't see your 450-frame well enough to be sure but, if it's an unaltered SCR-frame, then a stock Mk3-seat could not be normally-fitted to it !
However I'm not going to state that a std.w-c Mk3-seat won't fit your particular 450 because, there are already w-c Mk3-type side-covers mounted to it, which ought also not directly bolt-up to a stock SCR-frame.
(Wish I could check-out that frame personally.)


Dukaddy-DUKEs,
DCT-Bob
PLEASE NOTE... If this-post is not-yet signed-off with '-Bob', then I'm still in the process of completing it,, and if not also included with 'DCT' near bottom as well, then I may edit this post's wording at a later time. - Dct.Bob

MotoMike
Posts: 487
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2010 3:40 am

Re: 450 so far

Postby MotoMike » Thu Sep 02, 2010 2:09 am

Teckhardt
the frame does have the additional bracing on the frame and under the swing arm. the front wheel is an 18 incher. I didn't know about these anomalies in the 450 hubs and didn't pay attention when I had the tires put on.

Bob.
thanks, glad I'm not a blasphemer. the frame has ears welded to it that seem original that the boxes seem to mate with properly. and now that you mention it. If you look at the 450 owners manual in the tech section, it is titled "Over head cam-shaft DUCATI Motocycle 197, 450 Mark 3, 450 Mark 3 Desmo 450 Scrambler " print date 1970. On pages 5 and 6 are pictures titled Motorcycle 450 Mark 3, Motorcycle 450 Mark 3 Desmo, standard model and USA model. Clearly in thes pictures on page 5 and the USA model on page 6 have my tank and what I think are the same tool boxes. I am guessing that the gas cap can be fitted with the lever pointing forward or back, but mine came with it pointing forward and I note the pictures in the owners manual have the lever pointing forward. Most I have seen in pictures are pointing aft.

Of course these all have the rear loop of the frame straight and mine is clearly upturned.

I don't think the frame is unaltered. the tall loop that the scramblers have is not present on mine. and as to "then a stock MK3 seat could not bue fitted". hehe.. you don't know me very well :D

and to get a look at the frame... where do you live?

Thanks for the input. like to hear some more if other opinions exist.

Mike

DewCatTea-Bob
Posts: 2897
Joined: Sun Nov 01, 2009 10:53 am
Location: Near SE side of Lake Michigan

Re: 450 so far

Postby DewCatTea-Bob » Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:05 am

" the frame has ears welded to it that seem original that the boxes seem to mate with properly.
the USA model on page 6 have my tank and what I think are the same tool boxes.
Of course these all have the rear loop of the frame straight and mine is clearly upturned.
the tall loop that the scramblers have is not present on mine. "

____ It now seems to me that you have something unfamiliar to me which likely has been altered from the usual 450-production models that were imported to the USA.
While none of the DUCATI-dealer/shops that I worked at ever got-in any 450-model like yours, I have heard tale that towards the end of the 1970 production-year, Ducati made a few 450s with left-over production-line parts from both the Mk3 & SCR lines. _ Although until now, I never had any good reason to believe that tale.
And now that I really think of it, I do believe that (sometime in the distant-past), I have seen pix of (then new?) 450-models like yours (with std.Mk3-seat too, I think), but had then assumed that such had been made for the Canadian or Brit-market, or somewhere else other than here in the U.S.
__ What is the motor-number on yours? _ If it's older than my 1970-450, then I'd believe that yours was put-together with mixed parts that way, by somebody,, but if it's newer, then I might consider believing that tale about such factory-made 'mixed-parts models'.
____ BTW, could you please provide any well-lit close-up pix of the carb & cyl.head area of your 450? _ As I'd much like to see that carb & plumbing set-up you have, a lot better !


DUKE-Cheers,
-Bob
PLEASE NOTE... If this-post is not-yet signed-off with '-Bob', then I'm still in the process of completing it,, and if not also included with 'DCT' near bottom as well, then I may edit this post's wording at a later time. - Dct.Bob

MotoMike
Posts: 487
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2010 3:40 am

Re: 450 so far

Postby MotoMike » Thu Sep 02, 2010 1:26 pm

DewCatTea-Bob wrote:" the frame has ears welded to it that seem original that the boxes seem to mate with properly.
the USA model on page 6 have my tank and what I think are the same tool boxes.
Of course these all have the rear loop of the frame straight and mine is clearly upturned.
the tall loop that the scramblers have is not present on mine. "

____ It now seems to me that you have something unfamiliar to me which likely has been altered from the usual 450-production models that were imported to the USA.
While none of the DUCATI-dealer/shops that I worked at ever got-in any 450-model like yours, I have heard tale that towards the end of the 1970 production-year, Ducati made a few 450s with left-over production-line parts from both the Mk3 & SCR lines. _ Although until now, I never had any good reason to believe that tale.
And now that I really think of it, I do believe that (sometime in the distant-past), I have seen pix of (then new?) 450-models like yours (with std.Mk3-seat too, I think), but had then assumed that such had been made for the Canadian or Brit-market, or somewhere else other than here in the U.S.
__ What is the motor-number on yours? _ If it's older than my 1970-450, then I'd believe that yours was put-together with mixed parts that way, by somebody,, but if it's newer, then I might consider believing that tale about such factory-made 'mixed-parts models'.
____ BTW, could you please provide any well-lit close-up pix of the carb & cyl.head area of your 450? _ As I'd much like to see that carb & plumbing set-up you have, a lot better !


DUKE-Cheers,
-Bob


Bob, I'll get some close ups pretty soon. I would not have any problem believing it is pieced together. I bought it from a (then) small shop in San Diego with a clear preference towards British Iron. They were certainly not above using what they had around to make a runner. It still had mounting holes in the tank for the wing ducati logo to fasten to, but the badges were gone. It was a ratty looking thing back then, but it ran. with the dunstal type pipe that it had it was pretty loud too.

DewCatTea-Bob
Posts: 2897
Joined: Sun Nov 01, 2009 10:53 am
Location: Near SE side of Lake Michigan

Re: 450 so far

Postby DewCatTea-Bob » Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:40 pm

" I would not have any problem believing it is pieced together. "

____ Just as I had assumed you may have done yourself, (to your own liking).
But the main point of interest, in this case, is how those side-covers could be part of the same model as a frame that seems to be a SCR-version !? _ (As the SCR-models did not have any such side-covers!)
__ It's understandable that the stock (to SCR-frames only) 'fender/seat-support' (that's NORMALLY found [near/above the upper shock-mounts], on the rear-loop), would have been removed from a SCR-frame that has been modified to accept the type of seat that your's now has.
__ Still wondering what model-year your 450 actually is !?

____ When you're ready with your close-up pix of the carb-plumbing, you then ought to post them within your "Amal on my 450" thread, (it's possible to add pix to ANY past posting [of your own], with the use of the 'EDIT' feature),
and, here in this thread, just make note that you've done so.


Dukaddy-DUKEs,
-Bob
PLEASE NOTE... If this-post is not-yet signed-off with '-Bob', then I'm still in the process of completing it,, and if not also included with 'DCT' near bottom as well, then I may edit this post's wording at a later time. - Dct.Bob


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