Seized engine

[DewCatTea-Bob]

[quote= Ian B ...
" The arrows point to the end of the return spring and are in effect crossed over. "

____ From what I'm able to see at the view-angle of your pic.shot,, it appears that the r-spring's tail-ends are both indeed 'crossed-over' in-place around both pegs of the mechanism-parts, just as they're supposed to be.



" I fiited mine
into position.. not easy to do "

____ Indeed, the return-spring certainly can put-up some stubborn resistance while trying to be maneuvered properly into place & fitted between it's two mechanism-parts (and then become functionally 'set-up') !


Dukaddy-DUKEs,
DCT-Bob

[asmith411]

I have tried to position the spring on the shifter box without success. I'm assuming by your comments that the spring is required to be pulled across the post to apply tension to the spring. I've been unable to do this. I've had success applying tension while off the post, but as soon as I try to insert the post and release the spring it pops out.

Ian, I'm not quite sure about your explanation for using the lever arm. Did you use the pin on the selector fork to twist it over the pin below. I used pliers with success. I could tension the spring, but was unable to insert the arm. Boing! Here's a picture of the spring not tensioned.

Another question, what is the proper position of the offset pin at the slot in the back of the adjusting plate/spring retainer. Is the offset towards the pin or away from the pin (towards the ball bearing).

CopyIMG_0468.jpg

There are 4 pins on the shifting drum. Which pins line up between the selector fork in the neutral position. On the underside of the shifting drum there are 6 depressions for the ball bearing stops. Picture provided. Between the depressions there are white spots indicating the pin locations on the other side. Does the 2 pins where there are no depressions indicate neutral? See pictures.

CopyIMG_0471.jpg

CopyIMG_0470.jpg

[Ian B]

[quote="asmith411"]

Ian, I'm not quite sure about your explanation for using the lever arm. Did you use the pin on the selector fork to twist it over the pin below. I used pliers with success. I could tension the spring, but was unable to insert the arm. Boing! Here's a picture of the spring not tensioned.

Yes use the gear change shaft pushed loosely into place with the gear lever partially fitted. Make sure the bottom spring ear (nearest the gear lever) is in the right position, (in your pic it's not). Then hook the gear change shaft onto the upper ear of the spring and rotate the shaft by turning the gear lever until the spring is in the right place, once it's in the right place push the gear change shaft through the case fully and hold it there while you fit the gear lever fully into position. It's the gear lever that holds everything in the right place until you get the screws back in! I too tried pliers and soon realised this wasn't going to work. Boing indeed!
I told you it was easier to do than describe! Where are you? Perhaps another local member could show you if you have anyone nearby......

On the selector cam, the indents (where the ball goes) are all spaced the same except there in an extra one for neutral between 1st and 2nd. Line this one up to assemble in neutral, the slot on the end of the shaft should be vertical(ish) when in the right place.

Cheers
Ian

[DewCatTea-Bob]

[quote= asmith411 ...
" I have tried to position the spring on the shifter box without success.
I've had success applying tension while off the post, but as soon as I try to insert the post and release the spring it pops out. "

____ That the return-spring "pops out", is what I've meant by it & it's two mechanism-parts 'coming-undone'.
To help prevent that,, once you get the three parts 'loaded' together (and hold them kept that way), you then ought-to twist-down the spring's tail-ends further-down into place so that they aren't left so close to the tip-end/tops of the two peg-tabs. _ Cuz then that way, those spring-tails can't slip-up & off their pegs so darn easy (while you finish installing that loaded mechanism in-through the shifter/motor-cover) !



" I'm assuming by your comments that the spring is required to be pulled across the post to apply tension to the spring. I've been unable to do this. "

____ It's mainly just a matter of having the finger & hand strength to overpower the spring whilst you next squeeze-together & lock the two mechanism-parts back-together (with spring loaded in-between)...
To accomplish that, (with the realization that the two parts are normally kept aligned together at the 12-o'clock position),, first insert the return-spring into place over the shaft-spindle & down against it's base where it's round-peg is located. _ Then with the spring's obviously-intended tail-end positioned against it's round-peg, next likewise insert the spring's holder-plate over & down the shaft-spindle into place (mostly-encaging) the spring so that the plate's square peg/tab is placed aside it's intended spring-tail. - (Note that the spring's two mechanism-parts are of-course not-yet both properly aligned-together at the same o'clock-position as normally intended, and-thus must then [temporarily] be obviously cocked-apart [at the angle imposed by the relaxed spring-tails], at this-point during mechanism reassembly.)
Next comes the rather challenging effort ! ... While keeping the return-spring's two mechanism-parts pressed together, and-so that their respective pegs are each pressing against their-own intended spring-tail,, you must then use both hands to strongly grip those two parts so as to be able to overpower the spring and opposedly twist them just-past their normal 12-o'clock alignment position, at which point you can then finish pressing them all-the-way back-together with both their pegs then inserted between both spring-tails ! _ But you still shouldn't relax your effort until after you use a screwdriver pried-against the spring-tails to make-sure that they are both fully located more deeply onto the pegs and away from the tip-ends of the pegs, (against the desire of the spring). _ That way (with the spring-tails more securely held), they're then more likely to stay-put and not slip-off & pop-apart (while you carefully install the loaded mechanism into the shifter/motor-cover).



" what is the proper position of the offset pin at the slot in the back of the adjusting plate/spring retainer. "

____ If there were any specific position considered as "proper", then there'd be no need for it to be adjustable ! _ The particular setting of the eccentric-head depends on where it best provides for seamless UP and DOWN shifting.



" Is the offset towards the pin or away from the pin "

____ Only you know for-sure what other "pin" you actually mean ! _ (If you really want to be understood without your readers having to assume, then you have-to be rather over-descriptive, [as I most always am].)
__ Anyhow, the set position of the eccentric-head (of the adjuster-screw), only makes any difference fore & aft, as up & down makes no difference !
For now, it's randomly left position can be ignored until after you possibly discover that your shifter doesn't happen to properly reset for both up & down shifting.



" Which pins line up between the selector fork in the neutral position.
Does the 2 pins where there are no depressions indicate neutral? "

____ That's all stuff which you really don't need to know, since it will all go together & work regardless of which gear position you assemble it in !
If you still want to see the answers for yourself, then operate the assembled shifter-box until you get it set into it's neutral-position and then have a look-see to find-out.


Hopeful-Cheers,
DCT-Bob

[asmith411]

Success! I was able to rotate the spring over the post. I lightly greased the moving parts. As Bob said the shifter should find its way to neutral. It rotates fine with a large screwdriver.

Thanks to all.
Art

[DewCatTea-Bob]

[quote= asmith411 ...
" I was able to rotate the spring over the post. "

____ So were you able to accomplish the task with brute-force using just your manly-hands (to lodge the spring-tails against the pegs and twist the mechanism back together), or did you rather do it the smarter/girly-way by taking advantage of the foot-pedal's leverage (to overpower the spring) ?
__ So now that you've moved the spring-tails out of the way of the round-peg, I suppose you can now finally get the box-cover to fully-seat down-into place,, right ?
If so,, then I gather that you had simply stumbled into the same-old trap as most-other newbies who've removed the box-cover and the foot-lever, while then exploring the mechanism-innards,, thus-then allowing the return-spring an opportunity for getting it's chance to slip-apart & come-undone.



" As Bob said the shifter should find its way to neutral. "

____ Right, cuz before you reinstall your reassembled shifter/case-cover unit all-the-way back into place on the motor-case,, you first really ought check that it's own internal operation is completely functional, anyhow ! _ And during the process of doing that, you can then leave it's gear-selection set in the neutral-position.
__ Have you yet checked the shifter-mechanism's functional-operation,, and if-so, did it happen to shift upward and downward (without blanking), with it's eccentric-adjuster left set in whatever random position you had left it at ?



" It rotates fine with a large screwdriver. "

____ Am I to assume you're meaning that the selector-wheel will rotate-around well enough (without any snagging hang-ups, [other than the ball falling into it's notch-detents]), by leveraging your screwdriver through it's external-slot ?
If so, that's certainly-not supposed to be a regular operating-method,, but I suppose it doesn't really hurt anything.


Dukaddy-DUKEs,
-Bob