Temporary-note concerning Thread-page openings

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DewCatTea-Bob
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Major-topic Thread-post Directory Considerations

Postby DewCatTea-Bob » Mon Apr 28, 2014 10:57 am

[quote= machten ...
" I agree organising the threads into catagories would be beneficial in a few senses. "

____ But don't you think that virtually doing the same with a condensed-listing of representative links, would be at-least as good ?



" The trick is to have a "Taxonomy" of categories (in a forum sense - sub-forums) that is "comprehensive enough" without becoming so complex that you don't know what category a thread should be in. "

____ That's certainly a good point which I've also realized,, and when this subject has come-up in the past, that's why I've only suggested just the categories of 'frame/body' ; 'motor' ; 'electrical' ; & 'other' .
__ Having sub-forums certainly has some apparent logic behind it, however that's akin to wanting to eat a whole cake but not having all it's slices on just one table. - (pun intended)



" One of the limitations of a forum structure is that a thread can only be assigned to one specific category...
you can see a conflict can arise! "

____ Yes, that's kind-of a problem for an actual 'forum' based categorized spread-out, but certainly-NOT such a problem for a listing of representative 'links' to handle ! _ As any particular link certainly-could possibly be listed ANY number of times to direct to a same thread or post for whatever it's various contained relevant-points may be !
So I rather think that a dedicated section for 'TOPIC-links', is the ideal way-to-go !



" I can see the benefit of "Sticky's" for completed reference information too, "

____ I-myself think that that would only be good for forum-related threads such as 'Website requests', (so as to keep them from getting lost somewhere back within all the pages of old threads).


Hopeful-Cheers,
-Bob
PLEASE NOTE... If this-post is not-yet signed-off with '-Bob', then I'm still in the process of completing it,, and if not also included with 'DCT' near bottom as well, then I may edit this post's wording at a later time. - Dct.Bob

JimF
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Re: Temporary-note concerning Thread-page openings

Postby JimF » Mon Apr 28, 2014 12:16 pm

During the last few days , on top of applying for a new job and all else I have had some lion's share of my time occupied by a death in the family. I am not looking for sympathy here, but rather I just want you all to know I will be re-reading in detail and digesting the ideas for reformatting the forum in the days to come and that I haven't been giving suggestions any thought whatsoever in the last few days.

Bob, this is the reason I did not directly reply to your suggestions. Your initial post under this topic seemed to me to make important points and I did not want to appear to be ignoring them. Beyond that post I have been reading the replies but not wrapping my head around the concepts presented.

Let's keep this notion to re-organize going forward. I will this week try to put in to effect some of the suggestions expressed and continue to look to you guys for tweaks to make it all work easier and better.

Jim

machten
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Re: Temporary-note concerning Thread-page openings

Postby machten » Mon Apr 28, 2014 3:29 pm

" I agree organising the threads into catagories would be beneficial in a few senses. "

____ But don't you think that virtually doing the same with a condensed-listing of representative links, would be at-least as good ?


In short, no. I've done some business analysis in this area for data rich oil companies. Your assumption is that you can keep some listing condensed over time. I bet you London to a brick, you cannot.

____ Yes, that's kind-of a problem for an actual 'forum' based categorized spread-out, but certainly-NOT such a problem for a listing of representative 'links' to handle ! _ As any particular link certainly-could possibly be listed ANY number of times to direct to a same thread or post for whatever it's various contained relevant-points may be !


Yes...you could link to information that way, but exploiting the value of any stored information is about being able to provide a mechanism that is easier to find it yourself than to ask where it is, or for someone else for it. You yourself are often a victim of the latter, Bob. The major issue is that the forum has no search facility to follow links embedded in posts. If it did, it would be different, but it doesn't.

____ Yes, that's kind-of a problem for an actual 'forum' based categorized spread-out, but certainly-NOT such a problem for a listing of representative 'links' to handle ! _ As any particular link certainly-could possibly be listed ANY number of times to direct to a same thread or post for whatever it's various contained relevant-points may be !
So I rather think that a dedicated section for 'TOPIC-links', is the ideal way-to-go !


See above. On the basis that the total loss of any search mechanism is a consequence, I'd disagree.

Best regards,

Kev

machten
Posts: 507
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Re: Temporary-note concerning Thread-page openings

Postby machten » Mon Apr 28, 2014 3:48 pm

I should also have said...

Jim..

My sympathy to you and your family on your loss. Leave us to discuss these trivial things that "are of no great consequence in the affairs of man".

Kev

DewCatTea-Bob
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Major-topic Thread-post Directory Considerations

Postby DewCatTea-Bob » Mon Apr 28, 2014 6:05 pm

[quote= machten ...
" In short, no.
Your assumption is that you can keep some listing condensed over time. I bet you London to a brick, you cannot. "

____ When I used the word/term "condensed", I wasn't actually referring-to the intended ('extended') link-list itself, but rather that this intended new-feature would be 'condensed' relative to the overwhelming size of the entire forum ! _ So while the link-listing would of-course grow with time, it would ALWAYS remain relatively 'condensed' in relation to the ever expanding size of the entire forum which it addresses ! _ The expected condensation would thusly provide the possibility of rather DIRECT-access to most-any existing thread, WITHOUT having-to repeatedly sort-through many forum-pages to stumble-across various threads which may be-of particular-interest to anyone searching for topics related to whatever their interests may be.
As anyone who has ever tried doing-so could attest-to, It's NOT possible (on this w.site) to directly-access the vast-majority of forum-pages, (without having-to further open still more pages so as to make more page-choices become available to reach, especially for the forum-pages which are located nearer towards the center [such as page-20] ) !
The listed-link method not-only allows searchers to readily see ALL the thread-titles listed within just ONE-page, it also rather allows relatively instant DIRECT-access to any (fairly worthy) thread !!
__ Need I say-more (in response to your "no" response) ?


Yes...you could link to information that way, but exploiting the value of any stored information is about being able to provide a mechanism that is easier to find it yourself than to ask where it is, or for someone else for it. You yourself are often a victim of the latter, Bob. The major issue is that the forum has no search facility to follow links embedded in posts. If it did, it would be different, but it doesn't.
____ Before I respond directly to this, I wonder if you could restate it's intended point, in other-words ? _ Cuz I'm not exactly clear on how to make relevant-sense of all of it.



" See above.
I'd disagree. "

____ Kev, I can only conclude at this-point that I've somehow failed to get you to fully realize exactly what it is that I'm proposing to-be done to help everyone to more easily LOCATE preexisting forum-threads which may be fairly relevant to whatever they'd like to learn of, (which in-turn will help to keep the existing forum's already overly-expanded size from further unnecessary expansion with somewhat constantly repeated virtually-duplicated thread-topics !).
__ It seems quite clear to ME, that my proposed-idea is so potentially very-useful,, that anyone who disagrees, must-not fully realize just exactly what it is (that I've already quite clearly indicated should be done).
__ I'll try to construct a sample example of what it'd be like, (hopefully some-time later today, within this thread).


Hopeful-Cheers,
DCT-Bob
PLEASE NOTE... If this-post is not-yet signed-off with '-Bob', then I'm still in the process of completing it,, and if not also included with 'DCT' near bottom as well, then I may edit this post's wording at a later time. - Dct.Bob

DewCatTea-Bob
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Sample-example of a Link-directory to Established-threads

Postby DewCatTea-Bob » Mon Apr 28, 2014 8:51 pm

____ This listing of Topic-titles & links is for covering the most pertinent posts of the last three pages of the entire 39-page FORUM-section, and it's done here to provide ourselves with a sample conception of how such a thread directory listing could be helpful to locate already established threads concerning whatever topic anyone wishes to find related-info on.
__ While this sample/example has left the arrangement of the listed threads in the same particular order in which I found them listed, I suppose an effort could be made to rather keep them rearranged in some-other more logical order (such as alphabetical-order).
Also, when this intended listing becomes too-BIG,, we could choose to divide it into a reduced-sized PRIME-ary / (cream-of-the-crop) listing, atop/along-with a rather extended MINOR-ary listing (so that a searcher could then possibly find the more commonly quested topics more quickly, instead of having-to skim-through the entire extended-listing).

.......


ELECTRICAL-related...
Cure for SlowGlow-BrakeLight of "40watt" models
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=81

Ducati 160 Electrics question(s)
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=111

Interesting Ducati ignition?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=126

New Wiring Harness Design
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=110

Systems to Brighten Dim Lights on Alt.Powered models
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=66

12v conversion 66 narowcase m3
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=193

Intro and Alternator Question
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=200

Wiring my Duc (from welcome thread)
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=228




FRAME/BODY-related...
Seat cover for a 1969 Mark 3
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=45

Correct Tail Light?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=58

Tires
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=34

Bent Fork?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=63

Single Cable Part Numbers
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=78

Front Hubs
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=114

Frame geometry questions
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=120

Widecase cush drive bearings
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=175

450 R/T tail light holder
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=216

Length of 1969 Mark 3 rear fender
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=213

Looking for a clutch lever that would fit this Tomaselli set
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=242

ducati mk3 450 tank mounting
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=244




MOTOR/ENGINE-related...

Oil Change Question
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=22

COPING with the Stock Threaded Exhaust-Ring/Flange
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=33

Clutch pushrod seal
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=49

How to set up bevel gears
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=53

Crankcase bolt torque
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=76

Connecting Rod Dimensions
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=88

piston and rings
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=104

Exhaust Nut
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=112

Front sprocket for 160 Monza Jr
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=150

Surflex Clutch
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=156

Starter gear spring / leaf spring ?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=26

Trick for even clutch pull?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=190

Mainshaft oilway roll pin?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=205

Bottom bevel bearings.
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=203

Cylinder Spacer?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=218

Compression release
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=59

Pump overhaul.
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=214

Speedo @ Tach drive gear ratio's?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=223

Compression release photo needed
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=222

Ignition timing
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=230

A bevel with no shim needed?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=234

Borgo wire circlips
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=243



INTAKE-related...
450 R/T intake manifold questions/comments
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=117



CARBURETOR-related...
Carbs and Jetting Specs
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=83

Dellorto question - removing velocity stack
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=98

PHBH 30 Carb for 350 Narrowcase
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=130





TECHNICAL-related...
Sand or Glass-Bead Blast-Cleaning is often Bad-News!
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=32

Soda blasting carbs on the cheap!
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=11

New Electrex 'Generator System' for Singles
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=93

Making Cables
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=96

WARNING: INCORRECT-Info Published in many Workshop Manuals!
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=38

Mikuni Round Slide Jetting?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=220

drum polishing
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=185

Plain Bearing Conversion....Ideas?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=219

drum brake cutouts + boredom
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=229

CB350 Brake Plate in Grimeca Hub
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=225

Boyer Electronic Ignition Question?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=239

Points or Electronic Ignition?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=237

Fiberglass Tank sealant what do I use
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=241

What oil should I use?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=247




____ While I've found that the 'Quote' system of this w.site won't work too extensively for creating a virtual tree-structure with multiple-ary/extended side-branches,, it can be seen within the "MOTOR/ENGINE"-section however, that at-least primary side-branches -(such as "INTAKE") can still contain a secondary side-branch -(such as "CARBURETOR") as well,, all included within such a main/trunk-section -(like "MOTOR/ENGINE"), of my suggested 'Linked Thread-Directory' !
__ I really don't see how anybody would-not find such a (rather completed) thread-directory to be of fairly-useful use, (certainly considering how our w.site's search-engine can be so limited as it tends to be).
If ANYone can come-up with any good-reason for why my suggested thread-directory (with it's quick-links) ought-not be seriously considered,, then please post your rather negative thoughts on the matter, so that they can become addressed.


Finished-CHEERS,
DCT-Bob
PLEASE NOTE... If this-post is not-yet signed-off with '-Bob', then I'm still in the process of completing it,, and if not also included with 'DCT' near bottom as well, then I may edit this post's wording at a later time. - Dct.Bob

machten
Posts: 507
Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2011 12:57 pm

Re: Temporary-note concerning Thread-page openings

Postby machten » Wed Apr 30, 2014 5:18 am

____ Kev, I can only conclude at this-point that I've somehow failed to get you to fully realize exactly what it is that I'm proposing to-be done to help everyone to more easily LOCATE preexisting forum-threads which may be fairly relevant to whatever they'd like to learn of, (which in-turn will help to keep the existing forum's already overly-expanded size from further unnecessary expansion with somewhat constantly repeated virtually-duplicated thread-topics !).
__ It seems quite clear to ME, that my proposed-idea is so potentially very-useful,, that anyone who disagrees, must-not fully realize just exactly what it is (that I've already quite clearly indicated should be done).


Hi Bob,

Just to be clear...I agree what you are proposing WILL be a help, especially if the descriptions (e.g. in your example "Cure for SlowGlow-BrakeLight of "40watt" models")
are a good indication of the content. As I'm sure we're all aware, it's easy sometimes for subject matter to drift a bit within a thread (I'm guilty!). It may help if we all stay discplined in keeping discussions within threads relevent, but sometimes you might have a thread entitled "250 Mark 3 Restoration" for example, where some disparate gems of information pertaining to numerous catagories may be stored. Not sure how that might be handled.

I guess my main point (an objection would be far too strong a word, more a word of caution) is that it will rely on someone to maintain the structure on an on-going basis rather than rely on posters to classify their own information, the latter which seems to me to be more sustainable in the longer term. Regardless, there is nothing to be lost by trying it out. It could even be piloted with just one classification for a start. If you're willing to set it up, anything that allows us to better reap the gold nuggets in this forum ...I'm in full support of - and thank you.

Regards,

Kev

DewCatTea-Bob
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Major-topic Thread-post Directory Considerations

Postby DewCatTea-Bob » Thu May 01, 2014 1:35 pm

[quote= machten ...
" it's easy sometimes for subject matter to drift a bit within a thread
It may help if we all stay discplined in keeping discussions within threads relevent, but sometimes you might have a thread entitled "250 Mark 3 Restoration" for example, where some disparate gems of information pertaining to numerous catagories may be stored. Not sure how that might be handled. "

____ Well thread-postings are of-course known to be concocted by 'people' who are known to be apt to do what we-all do, and-so we sort-of have-to expect that when we read their writings, we'll then likely also just have-to read & learn of other things along-with that which we're particularly only interested in, as well.
__ But it would certainly help if everyone would APPROPRIATELY title their thread-topics, and make use of most of the 60-spaces available for that.



" I guess my main point
is that it will rely on someone to maintain the structure on an on-going basis "


____ Yes, and-so I suspect that since there's no automatic method to keep-up with new thread creation at the same rate which it HAS BEEN, the intended thread-directory will fall-behind at times. _ BUT since the-hope is to curtail consistently virtually duplicated-thread creation,, the rate at which new-threads pop-up, then shouldn't be as difficult to keep-up with.



" it will rely on someone to maintain the structure on an on-going basis
rather than rely on posters to classify their own information, "

____ Good point ! _ But considering the rather common/average care-factor (of most-sorts to actually care much for taking-time to maintain such logical order & discipline, [such as only the likes of myself seem apt-to actually carry-out around here] ),, I'm thusly not so sure that we ought-to "rely" on everyone to choose the most-appropriate section selection for themselves, anyhow.


____ Just within a few years back, I had suggested that once thread-topics become displaced off-from the front-page (and before getting pushed-back to page-3),, that they then get suitably classified & filed-away into my suggested four or five categorized-sections, so as to provide for simpler & less time-consuming manual search-throughs.
But even with that logically divvied-up thread-filing, (of nearly 1k-threads),, by NOW, each of all those separated sections would also be too-extensive (to easily sort-through, using the only currently available method) !
And that realization is what has since led to the spawning of my idea to do the same kind of organization, but rather-instead with just a listing of mere 'links' (to the more relevant contents of the entire compilation of archived threads).
Seems like a 'no-brainer', (at-least to me).


Hopeful-Cheers,
DCT-Bob
PLEASE NOTE... If this-post is not-yet signed-off with '-Bob', then I'm still in the process of completing it,, and if not also included with 'DCT' near bottom as well, then I may edit this post's wording at a later time. - Dct.Bob

JimF
Site Admin
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Re: Temporary-note concerning Thread-page openings

Postby JimF » Sat May 03, 2014 8:05 pm

Bob,

I have tried to make some sticky notes, but when I cut and paste your lists with hyperlinks all the hyperlinks go dead. Do you have a trick that made the hyperlinks to other threads withing the forum?


Jim

DewCatTea-Bob
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MAJOR-topic Thread-posting Directory Considerations

Postby DewCatTea-Bob » Sat May 03, 2014 10:08 pm

[quote= JimF ...
" I have tried to make some sticky notes, but when I cut and paste your lists with hyperlinks all the hyperlinks go dead. Do you have a trick that made the hyperlinks to other threads withing the forum? "

____ There's really no trick involved Jim,, I'm pretty-sure of what's happening with the links, once ya have tried to copy them.
But more-importantly to get ironed-out first.....
____ I see what you've started with your sticky-notes method-idea to address the situation which I've tried to fully-explain. _ And it seems that (at-least) you haven't fully grasped ALL the involved factors which my-own plan-work pretty-much solves. ...
If your work today is meant to be permanent, then it seems you've somewhat jumped-the-gun & gone-onward prematurely (without having first fairly discussed what OUGHT-to be done to best accomplish the intended-goal).
That "SAMPLE-example" I MERELY began, (which you've gone-ahead & already delved-into),, was-not meant as a fully-cooked & complete finished-product to make any rather permanent copies of !
__ Of-course you could possibly keep your sticky-notes listed as you have them, if you wish,, but I think they ought-to only contain just cream-of-the-crop prime-examples of such, (as the VAST-majority of the contained listed threads are-not really so 'common' [or even "questions"] !).
And-also, it's my-own opinion that such an excess number of sticky-notes (which appear pretty-much no-different than regular new threads),, sort-of tend to spoil the NEWEST-THREAD ALWAYS FOUND AT THE VERY-TOP custom, which we've all naturally come-to always expect.
____ Since mid-2011, I've been meaning to ask you if you could create another BOXED-section below or within the 'ANNOUNCEMENTS' box and-also rather directly above the 'TOPICS' box (on the forum page), and title it 'Linked-Thread Directory' (or the like), so that I could then fill it with categorized links to most-ALL of the long-established past-threads, (for addressing all the reasons I've mentioned so-far, for doing such).
__ Is there something you don't like about that request, or is it not possible to add another such boxed-section to the page ?

____ Anyone-else with pertinent thoughts, certainly may chime-in with your related comments concerning any of this stuff.


Hopeful-Cheers,
-Bob
PLEASE NOTE... If this-post is not-yet signed-off with '-Bob', then I'm still in the process of completing it,, and if not also included with 'DCT' near bottom as well, then I may edit this post's wording at a later time. - Dct.Bob


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