Front Running Light

[ecurbruce]

Derek and Bob,
Bob says;
____ Another member (some time back) had somehow found a H4-type bulb-holder which fit within a stock headlamp... So it would be nice if he'd soon chime-in & remind us of where he had obtained such a convenient part from !

This is probably useless info, but a while back I mentioned the 12 volt headlamp I was using, within my thread "six coil alternator in a narrow case engine"...
The thing is, the bulb is a HB3 which is only one filament (no high beam-low beam) and 60 watts.
The bulb holder I used is from a BMW 3 series composite headlamp, around '97-'2003, high beam side. The amber bulb holder ring unscrews form the back of the BMW headlamp assembly, and it's outside diameter is exactly the same measurement as the hole in the Ducati headlight reflector.

In this photo you can see the amber ring, although the bulb is xenon, the HB3 is what fits in there. I took that photo a while back when I was testing to see if I could use the xenon with the original alternator, which spawned all the discussion about getting the most current we could from an alternator...
I now use the halogen bulb in there.
Placement of the amber ring is critical to how the beam is projected, and has to be worked out proior to glueing the amber ring into place.
Bruce.

[DewCatTea-Bob]

[quote="ecurbruce"]
" a while back I mentioned the 12 volt headlamp I was using, within my thread "six coil alternator in a narrow case engine"... "

____ That's a very interesting thread which you had started ! ... viewtopic.php?f=3&t=593&p=4012#p3794



" it's outside diameter is exactly the same measurement as the hole in the Ducati headlight reflector. "

____ First-off, I had hoped that you & your HL.mod was indeed the very-same mod.story I thought I recalled,, however YOURS concerns a bulb-HOLDER which happens to fit-into a stock light-reflector/dish, whaeras the tale I remember was of a H4-bulb holder & it's reflector-dish which happens to fit (well enough) into a stock headlamp-rim, (although I don't really recall which size headlamp it was, I think it was for a w-c.size-type headlamp).
__ Does anybody-else recall any such tale ever posted by anyone here (in OUR forum) ?


" I now use the halogen bulb in there. "

____ Do you mean a common-type H4-Hi/Low bulb ?


____ Thanks Bruce !


Hopeful-Cheers,
-Bob

[ecurbruce]

Bruce said;
" I now use the halogen bulb in there. "
Bob replied;
____ Do you mean a common-type H4-Hi/Low bulb ?

Well, i'm afraid not, this bulb holder is for a high beam only bulb, single filament HB3... which is why I said " this may be useless information" this bulb is also 60 watts which is a little high wattage for the Ducati alternator. With this setup I only have one headlight selection, no high beam or no low beam, which ever way you want t look at it.

Bruce.

[DewCatTea-Bob]

[quote="ecurbruce"]
" this bulb holder is for a high beam only bulb, single filament HB3... "

____ Alright-then, it seems that I should've realized that your "HB3" & your "halogen bulb" were actually one & the same.


" this bulb is also 60 watts which is a little high wattage for the Ducati alternator. "

____ For a stock-type charging-system setup, a 60w.bulb would indeed over-draw from the battery-reserves during average-RPM.riding, but I thought you had sufficiently modified your alternator & charging-system to adequately compensate for your headlight-choice. (?)
So could you possibly sometime 'update' us with all related details concerning your charging-system components & wiring-connections, and, (providing that you've riden your Duke enough time to be able to tell), how well your battery's charge holds-up for your chosen type of (average-RPM)- riding conditions ?
And if-so, it would be preferred if you'd do-so within that old thread of yours.
As I'd like to contemplate your system for it's 'pros&cons'.


Hopeful-Cheers,
-Bob

[Glawster]

In the end I kept it simple and just fitted a 6v 25/25w quartz halogen bulb - sourced from Paul Goff www.norbsa02.freeuk.com . I'm not sure how much brighter it will be but for sure it should be better than the standard bulb. Thanks for all the info - I've now got a bit more confidence that the alternator will manage the charge to run this modestly powered lighting system during daylight hours.

[DewCatTea-Bob]

[quote="Glawster"]
" just fitted a 6v 25/25w quartz halogen bulb "

____ Didn't know such a HL.bulb was ever produced.
Did it fit the stock headlamp-socket setup same as a stock-bulb, without any mods at all, (or was it a H4-type or something) ?
__ Were there not any-other similar but stronger bulbs to be found (other than just that mere 25w choice) ?
__ Your "70-watt" w-c.charging-system should easily handle a 45w headlight-bulb.



" I'm not sure how much brighter it will be but for sure it should be better than the standard bulb. "

____ I wonder what YOUR std.bulb was (in your newer w-c.Duke) ?
__ If your new "25/25w" bulb had been a xenon-type, then I would indeed expect it to be substancially brighter, but otherwise I really wouldn't expect a halogen-type 25w.bulb to be notably brighter than a 35 or 45w std.bulb.
I'd expect that the only really good-aspect about your modest-power bulb-choice is that you could now likely run at relatively low-RPMs all day & night with lights left turned-on whilst stuck in city traffic-jams.



" I've now got a bit more confidence that the alternator will manage the charge to run this modestly powered lighting system during daylight hours. "

____ What had ever led you to not have confidence in the stock-system, anyhow ? _ As all stock Duke-models with battery-powered lighting-systems never experience any related power-deficiencies ! _ (Only when/after running with the battery-connection broken, or with a substancially increased load-system (such as with a 60w headlight), do the stock charging-systems then become a concern.)

____ Anyhow,, with your chosen bulb being only 25/25w, I much recommend that instead of letting that bulb remain wired-up as stock to the Hi/Low light-switch in the std.normal manor, that it rather be wired-up so that the low-beam is always KEPT lite-up (with the light-switch), while the Hi/Low-switch ought remain employed for turning-on the high-beam. _ That way, you may then CHOOSE whether-or-not to run BOTH high & low beams together-at-once whenever running at night, (so as to then achieve a more useful & modern-standard amount of projected-light on dark roads) !
__ This is a very-fine option, because then you can possibly have the best of both worlds ! ...
That is, you could then have a rather low power-drain 25w.headlight for city-driving (night or day),, and-yet ALSO, choose to run with a MORE-useful amount of light by making-use of the resulting 50w.headlight-option, for night-riding (just whenever you think you most need the added/combined light).
__ And so long as you keep your eng.revs fairly-well above 4000-RPM (on average), then your battery should still stay adequitely charged even with BOTH 25w.circuits left turned-on.
__ The required wiring-mod would be fairly quite SIMPLE ! ... You'd merely need to add a jumper-wire (of rather short length, 18-gauge), so as to DIRECTLY-connect the light-switch's headlamp power-circuit (that runs out-TO the Hi/Low-switch), to the headlight's low-beam load-circuit, (thus-then providing a bypass-circuit [for the Hi/Low-switch & low-beam circuit] ).
__ The only related concern which really OUGHT-to be addressed, for constantly running with 50-watts of totaled headlight-power,, is that the headlight's common-circuit ground-wire be well-grounded, and preferably at-least 12-gauge (for 6-volt systems with that HL.ground-wire ran-back all the way to the battery-ground), or-else 14-gauge (for the much shorter stock-length).
____ This headlight-mod in combo with the 25/25w-6v.bulb should be a very-good alternative-option for obtaining (rather optional) brighter-lighting, for those who have a n-c.Duke-model with stock battery-powered type lighting-systems !


Duke-Cheers,
DCT-Bob

[Glawster]

Hi Bob,
This guy Paul Goff has a full range of 6v QH bulbs. They are the standard P20D fitting - same as the regular bulb. I replaced a standard 25/25w.
Probably I should have gone for a 35/35w as I think these are also available, but your suggestion to rewire the system to keep the low beam on constantly seems a good idea. And using only 25w it should easily maintain charge for daytime use. I used a new wiring loom so I don't think there should be any grounding problems.
Best regards,
Derek

[DewCatTea-Bob]

[quote="Glawster"]
" They are the standard P20D fitting - same as the regular bulb. "

____ Over-here in the U.States, I'm sure that none of the WideCase-models came stock with the old-type bulb/globes (like many of the older n-c.models came with), as sealedbeam-type headlights were required in most States.
But still, it's nice that the old filiment-bulbs have been updated at-least to halogen-brightness ! _ (Too-bad you didn't find & get a xenon-type, as I understand that that-type is about 3-times brighter for the same amount of wattage-consumption.)



" I replaced a standard 25/25w. "

____ I'm not really sure what YOUR country required but, I'm sort-of sure that the "25/25w" HL.bulb was-not the standard 6v.rating for the battery-powered road-models... I am quite sure however, that that rather low-wattage 6v.selection was original-stock for the AC.powered n-c.Duke-models,, while most-all of the road-models employed either 30/30w.bulbs or 35/35w.sealedbeams.
And also, later-edition n-c.models (with the 60w.alt) & w-c.models could run optional 45/40w.sealedbeams without any notable down-side issues.
__ I've seen in some parts-books that only the 25/25w.6-volt HL.bulbs were listed for ALL models, so-thus I guess it's fair to conclude that THAT's the 'standard' HL.bulb. _ But it seems to me that, (sealed-beam equipped, & AC.powered-models left-aside), I most-always found 30/30w.bulbs already installed (in used-DUKEs), or whenever I'd get a new HL.bulb, it would be a 30/30w.version. _ So I suppose that that's the selection which Berliner likely stocked as a std.replacement-bulb (if battery-powered Duke-models weren't imported already equipped with such).
So anyhow,, despite the parts-books, it's a fairly strong memory for me that the AC.powered Duke-models had the 25/25w-HL.bulbs, and the battery-powered models had 30/30w.bulbs.
__ (BTW, putting a 6v.30/30w.bulb into an AC.model would make it's headlight stay even dimmer until a higher-RPM (than normal). _ So I believe that it was 18/18w and/or 20/15w 6v.bulbs which were fairly-often used as replacement-bulbs, so as to help make their headlights look brighter.)



" Probably I should have gone for a 35/35w as I think these are also available, "

____ That would've been more like expected for a w-c.road-model, and shouldn't present any problems in city-driving conditions (with a fully operating stock charging-system).
__ (You haven't yet replied as-to what had ever led you to think that your w-c.charging-system may-not be up-to it's expected lighting-task.)



" your suggestion to rewire the system to keep the low beam on constantly seems a good idea. "

____ Not "constantly" (with the key-switch), but rather only whenever the light-switch is turned-on (and-so with the low-beam left ON even when the Hi/Low-switch is in it's Hi-position).
__ And also,, the required-mod is so simple, that the word "rewire" can be misleading...
Cuz rather than wire-up a 'jumper-wire', you could instead simply use a quick-connect '3M' wire-splicer, to short-circuit together the two associated headlamp wire-circuits. -
(Exact details available, for the asking.)



" And using only 25w it should easily maintain charge for daytime use. "

____ You must really mean 'city-traffic' "use" (where eng.revs are kept rather low), cuz of-course the charging-system cares NOT whether it's night OR "daytime" !
__ The 25w plus 25w would be more suitable for the n-c.60w-system, however the w-c.70w-system really ought-to handle a 35+35w combined lighting-circuit, so long as eng.revs are kept high enough, (which would be the expected case whenever running OUT-side of the-city), as the '70-watts' (of the w-c.alt) is merely a 'rating' which is expected for regular/normal average-RPM riding,, meaning that any higher of an average-RPM would likewise provide a resulting correspondingly-higher alt.wattage.
So that means whenever riding with BOTH 35w.light-circuits activated for any over-extended time-period, the average engine-revs will then need to be kept fairly higher than the normal-average - (nearer to 6k [rather than the reg.normal 4.5k-RPM average] ). _ And as it conveniently works-out, it stands to fair-reason that brighter-lighting is only really desired when doing spirited high-RPM riding, anyhow.
Ya just wouldn't be able to ride too-long with both 35w.circuits left turned-on while the eng.revs are kept below 4k-RPM, (of-course!).



" I used a new wiring loom so I don't think there should be any grounding problems. "

____ I wouldn't count on it remaining that way for long if it's a factory-STOCK wiring-loom/harness, as their chosen wiring-gauges -(18 & 16 gauge) were rather cheap for 6-volt type current-flow !
And-also, the stock common/ground-wire was only expected to carry the current-flow of just ONE HL.circuit at a time,, so whenever BOTH HL.circuits are activated, the stock ground-wire will then be fairly overtaxed.
__ But rather than replace it with a 12 or 14-gauge wire, I'd rather suggest leaving it as-is, but also ADD an additional 16-guage HL.ground-wire and route it to it's very-own grounding-point (separated from the stock-wire's grounding-point) and grounded somewhere OUTSIDE of the headlamp (preferably at the battery's grounding-point).


Duke-Cheers,
DCT-Bob