1965 Ducati ????

[jivey5870]

I recently acquired this bike in a barn find here in Alaska. It was listed as a 1965 Mach 1. I am not sure what it is really. It appears to have had several mods over the years. The original 250cc engine was replaced with a 350cc. I know the rear sets are not original, but beyond that, I have no clue. I have it at my local Ducati dealership to have them inspect it and see what they can turn up. Meanwhile, I thought I would see what everyone here had to say about it.

[jivey5870]

More pics!

[joe46ho]

Did you get a title with the duke ? Does it say mach 1 ? I only ask because if not then it would be impossible to tell if it really was a mach 1 originally, looking at the pics its apparent that its missing the mach 1 clip ons, controls, headlight assembly, front fender (possibly rear also but I cant tell from the pics) the mach 1 fuel tank, ss1-29d carb. factory installed rear sets, rims, upper triple tree clamp, upper fork plugs, k/s lever, rear shocks, tires, headlamp ears, speedometer, switches, tail light, and number plate bracket, also the original center stand is missing (looks like a monza jr. one on there) also missing the mach 1 seat, tool boxes, tachometer and bracket and the factory sidestand are missing. I am sure I am leaving some stuff out (possibly the voltage regulator/rectifier box) Also I would need to see the case/serial # because I have seen plenty of people install a 350 n/c top end on a 250 case, counting the fins on the cylinder it looks to be a 350 (you can never go solely on the numbers on the cam end cap, and case since a 250 or 350 n/c crankcase, and cam cap are basically the same, except for the cast-in numbers, the stamped numbers, and the 1966 only kickstart setup on the 350, which is also on the 1966 250, but not on any earlier 250's)

Sorry if thats a lot to swallow, but honestly it looks like a good start to a cafe racer/bitsa project to me. But not a mach 1, and to be honest even if it started life as a mach 1 it would cost a small fortune (literally) to source all the parts to put it back to oem specs, but that doesnt mean its impossible, others have started with less...

For some very nice detailed pictures of a mach 1, go to Phil Aynsley's site here
http://www.philaphoto.com/imageLibrary/ ... p?album=46


Joe

[JimF]

What Joe says is all true, if it was a Mach 1 someone or many people have over time stripped off all the components that make a Mach 1 just that.

Basically a Mach 1 starts with a 250cc engine that bears a factory stamping of "DM250M1" on the cases. Most Mach 1 frames have stampings in the main frame tube that runs down between the engine and battery tray. With the M1 engine gone so goes the heart of the Mach 1.

All the little bits and bobs like the curved kick start lever, the rear-sets and the clip-ons are gone.


BUT....

You still have a sweet narrowcase Ducati single and they are all a blast to ride. The thing is you can do whatever you want to this bike and have no guilt or fights with your conscience over what you are doing to the bike. I would suggest to you that you have both a real treasure and an opportunity. Look at 250 bitsas and think about what you like and what you don't like. Then make yours to be everything you like.

Really though, if the engine runs you should ride it (I realize that's probably not possible in Alaska in January) to see what makes these little gems so special. You'll understand then why you should spend time and money on it .

Jim

[jivey5870]

I will agree with you Jim in that it is a treasure. Regardless of what it is, I plan on fixing it up and having a blast riding. It also came with two treasure chests of parts(fenders, rear sets, sprockets, and even an extra frame)! And no, I am not going to sell it. : )

[JimF]

And some of that stuff in the boxes might actually be treasure...


Certain fenders, rear-sets if factory, and many other items sell for big money on eBay, so when faced with a daunting bill for some engine bits or paint work or the like, you might find something in the treasure boxes that will mitigate the cost to get the 250 where it needs to be.


I think you will love riding the 250. At perhaps around 250 pounds wet and so low to the ground the bikes are pure fun.

[double diamond]

Your frame has a few typical race chassis modifications that have the consequence of obliterating the original specification. It has the longer swingarm axle with outboard mounts added to reinforce the swingarm pivot. This mod required that, were they present, the original rearset footpeg mounts have to be removed. Also, any toolbox mounts that may have been present appear to have been removed. The only clue to the origins of the frame is the battery box, which looks more like a scrambler battery box. In any case, it’s a pretty interesting, well turned out period Ducati racer. Especially like the tach mount. Would you post some pics of the parts that were included and the other frame? It would be interesting to see what you’ve got. Matt

[DewCatTea-Bob]

By: jivey5870...
" I recently acquired this bike
It was listed as a 1965 Mach 1. I am not sure what it is really.
The original 250cc engine was replaced with a 350cc.
I have no clue. I thought I would see what everyone here had to say about it. "

____ Thanks much for joining with us all here !
And while many bikers would agree that your 'bitsa' Duke-find is but just a mere "bike", it still really qualifies pretty-much as a full-fledged 'DUKE' , (even if no-longer a std. 'Duke-model'). _ I find it to be a very interesting and quite worthwhile Duke to have a chance to check-out !
However I'd have to agree with anyone-else who would consider it to not be a real 'Mach I', as it seems that most-EVERYthing which makes a Mach-I the particular Duke-model that it is, has been left missing from your presented Duke !
The epitome of a Mach-I is it's 'M1' stamped motor-case, and I suppose if at least that was still remaining intact, and ya also had original -(not really meaning the VERY-original), matching paperwork to go-with,, THEN I (for one) would not argue against it still remaining as an original 'Mach I' Duke-model.
So the bottom-line seems to be as to whether or not the ORIGINAL 'M1' stamping is on the motor-case !? _ That's a relatively important consideration due to the unique rarity & desirability of that particularly prized Duke-model !
So if your Duke's motor-case has that M1-stamping, then you ought to post a pic of it here,, but otherwise if you don't, then we'll all be left to just consider your Duke as being a mere 'bitsa',(although a fairly well-done one).
__ On another hand, if someone took a completely stock 250Mach-I and replaced it's stock-motor's crankshaft with a n-c.350-crankshaft, I'd then be somewhat torn as to whether it was really fair to continue-on referring to the resulting Duke as still remaining to be an actual Mach-I Duke-model. _ But if the whole M1.motor was replaced with a n-c.350Sebring-motor, then I could certainly argue against the resulting Duke being able to still be referred-to as a Mach-I, (cuz [for one thing], it's papers would no-longer completely match-up).
So therefore if the only remaining part left of a Mach-I, was it's original unaltered M1-frame,, then I (for one) would definitely no-longer consider such a Duke to be a real 'Mach-I', (UNLESS it had gotten another 250M1-motor installed, [even if NO-other M1.parts] ).
__ And, it seems (rather more obvious) that your Duke's frame is most-likely a 1966/250 Scrambler-frame,, since, (as has already been pointed-out), it's battery-tray appears to be the same type as, (rather than that of a stock M1.frame).
____ Something-else that's of more interest (at least to me), is your (apparent) "350" motor ...
What size is the carb on that ? _ Have you ever removed it from the cyl.head yet ? _ If not,, you ought to do so, so that you can then check to determine the size of the intake-port.

[jivey5870]

Mystery solved.... I stopped by the dealership and saw my mechanic. It is a 1965 Ducati Scrambler that was modified for track use. The good news is that it needs only minor engine work. The bad news... There are no numbers to be found anywhere on the bike, making it next to impossible to make it street legal. So now my dilemma... Do I try and restore it as a scrambler, or fix it up as a cool cafe racer and take my chances with the police? I am leaning towards option #2!

I will post some picks of the spare parts when I get a chance. It may be a few days as I am in the process of moving.

[DewCatTea-Bob]

" I stopped by the dealership and saw my mechanic. It is a 1965 Ducati Scrambler "

____ Well it's possible that the frame was actually produced in "1965", however it's definately NOT a 1965-model frame ! ...
As 250-frames with battery-trays like that, were ONLY made for the 1966 n-c.Scrambler-model !



" There are no numbers to be found anywhere on the bike "

____ How about posting a picture of the area of the motor-case that's just in front of the cylinder-jug & behind the upper motor-mount connection-point (near the front down-tube of the frame) ? _ That way, we can all see for ourselves what's amiss.


" Do I try and restore it as a scrambler, or fix it up as a cool cafe racer "

____ I-myself say, why try to undo all the work already done ?
It would be too great of an endeavor to do a stock Scrambler restoration-job, but-however a rather easy task to basically keep it as that which the previous-owner(s) obviously had intended... a Duke/cafe-racer.


Hopeful-Cheers,
-Bob