Late narrowcase battery box

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kmev
Posts: 91
Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2009 1:55 am
Location: Wisconsin

Re: Late narrowcase battery box

Postby kmev » Sun Jan 03, 2010 5:14 pm

Yeah, the black paint doesn't photograph well - you can't see anything but the blemishes. Below is a photo I took after I welded the tray on, but before the mounts for the battery strap and fender were added. You can also see how big the hole was for the switch.

To fill holes, just put one little spot of weld on the edge of the hole, then add another little spot on top of that one, and keep going until you've worked your way all the way across the hole. This was good practice for me, because I accidentally blew a hole though my footpeg mount with the torch while I was heating it to straighten it out and had to fill that hole, too. :lol:

One thing I realized this morning is I made the mistake of positioning the fender tab according to the where the hole in my fender was. Of course, the fender isn't straight so my fender tab is a now a little off center. Of course, it now matches my off-center front fender!

While I was at it, I also added an upper spring mount and bumper for a center stand, as it seems scrambler frames did't get them at the factory.

For batteries, I found this one by google-searching 7Ah batteries: http://www.batteriesinaflash.com/motorc ... aces-b39-6

It's the proper dimensions to fit in the tray, so I just made the tray to the original size since it appears it won't be too hard to get a proper size battery (but I haven't tried ordering one yet, so I may be mistaken).
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joe46ho
Posts: 247
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Location: Erlanger, Ky
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Re: Late narrowcase battery box

Postby joe46ho » Wed Jul 27, 2011 4:35 pm

Kmev

Any chance I could persuade you (in your spare time, no rush) to measure all the dimensions of your battery tray for me ? I have run into the same "hacked off tray" problem as you had. But mine is a little worse, I am missing all but about a quarter sized piece of mine...any help would be greatly appreciated...
Joe
Too many projects to list...
12 Ducati singles currently

Jon Pegler
Posts: 471
Joined: Sun May 16, 2010 6:19 pm

Re: Late narrowcase battery box

Postby Jon Pegler » Wed Jul 27, 2011 5:28 pm

For anyone who has a butchered frame and doesn't want to fabricate a new battery platform, Barry Jones at Classic Ducati in the UK sells a replacement one.
It still needs welding onto the frame though.
I've not fitted one myself, but it looks to be a fairly good copy of the original.

Jon

joe46ho
Posts: 247
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2011 10:45 pm
Location: Erlanger, Ky
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Re: Late narrowcase battery box

Postby joe46ho » Wed Jul 27, 2011 8:08 pm

John...

If you are refering to this one,

http://www.classicducati.com/index.php? ... ductId=373

I have bought one, and they are a very good reproduction...

Unfortunately they look completely different than the 66' Scr tray, which I believe is a one year only type thing...

Joe
Too many projects to list...
12 Ducati singles currently

DewCatTea-Bob
Posts: 2897
Joined: Sun Nov 01, 2009 10:53 am
Location: Near SE side of Lake Michigan

Battery-tray Platform-types

Postby DewCatTea-Bob » Wed Jul 27, 2011 9:52 pm

" Unfortunately they look completely different than the 66' Scr tray, which I believe is a one year only type thing... "

____ The unique battery mounting-tray of the 1966-version of the 250-Scrambler was nicer in that it's platform-base much better held the (originally intended!) stock-battery from getting vibrated all around on it's surface, and it's particular method for securing the battery in-place, was somewhat superior as well.
And while I never bothered to do an exact/measured comparison, I do believe that that complete b.mounting-tray was copied-over from that of the 125-Bronco.
__ The main downside to that particular battery mounting-setup, is that besides the b.tray/platform-mount itself, (which was directly welded to those frame-models it was fitted to), it was expected to retain it's intended battery along-with the help of an added top-piece fitted to the back-plate (of the platform), and that added piece was rather easy to get lost since it was somewhat loosely fitted-into & held by the b.mount's back-plate and strapped-down by a rather poor-quality rubber-strap.
On top of that fairly frequent common-trouble, that top-piece cover-plate was particularly fashioned to snugly fit against/over the unique plastic-cover of the particular*battery which Ducati had chosen to employ for/in those two Duke-models. _ And that particular battery was relatively expensive & uneasy to find, compared to most similarly sized batteries,, so that rather unique battery mounting-tray setup was a general overall PAIN for their owners ! _ And thus those stock cover-plates were simply often outwardly discarded, (if not lost first) !
__ The only other battery, (most common back then), which even came close to the same dimensions (of the stock-battery), was about 6mm thicker,, and so the rear-side slightly-lifted ridge-edge of the platform-base, (which was so nicely spaced & placed for helpfully retaining the thinner stock-battery), would prevent that (common/cheap 6v) battery from fitting squarely down-in on the flat of the mounting-tray's platform-base.
Between that circumstance and the quite unique intended cover-plate top-piece fitment-issue (along with it's poor strap), I've come to have noted quite a number of Duke-owners of such, to have been fairly frustrated with whatever alternate means they had to come-up with to deal with that problematic predicament.
(If only that stock-battery had allowed simple viewing of it's water-level, then that unique battery may have allowed it's [lazy] owners to have gotten it's expected value out of it.)
____ Joe, since there's additional room in front of the rear-fender for a battery that's nearly twice as thick, and since your frame's stock b.mounting-tray has already been removed/destroyed anyhow,, then why not logically consider installing a much better battery retaining method/system instead ?
If I were in your position, I'd start looking for a suitable battery-tray/cage which could possibly be rubber-suspension mounted from-under the frame-tubes beneath the seat.
You could look-through a jap.bike junk-yard for many alternate styles of such b.tray-cages, and likely find a suitably fittable example for such mounting-installation, (without need for messy welding).
__ Otherwise, it's a somewhat difficult-call as to whether to go-through all the trouble of going the route which kmev had bothered to do (to remain as stock), or, attempt to make-use of one of those far-more common regular/std.base-plate only, type of battery-trays, which would preferably allow fitting of a more useful larger-sized battery.


" I have bought one, and they are a very good reproduction... "

____ Joe, did it come complete with the underneath piece of bracing-work that's needed to help support that tray/platform-base ? _ As their presented picture (of their reproduction-work) doesn't look as if that support-brace is included under the presented (otherwise complete) base-plate, (cuz it appears that the tab-bracket [for the fender] is all that's holding-up the base-plate from laying-down flatly, [as seen in the pic] ).
__ Without any support-bracket included to (mainly!) help securely-hold the tray-platform/base-plate (from underneath), I can then certainly assure you that the base-plate will crack (relatively soon) all-around the edge of the intended weld-bead, even if a battery is never supported by it !

____ For anyone interested in more such related posts, here's a link to another/older thread to check-out. - viewtopic.php?f=3&t=409


Fun-Cheers,
-Bob
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PLEASE NOTE... If this-post is not-yet signed-off with '-Bob', then I'm still in the process of completing it,, and if not also included with 'DCT' near bottom as well, then I may edit this post's wording at a later time. - Dct.Bob

joe46ho
Posts: 247
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Re: Late narrowcase battery box

Postby joe46ho » Fri Aug 05, 2011 4:43 pm

Bob,
They do come as shown, so I guess they arent 100% correct but closest thing ive seen anyone make... I added 2 frame/tubing gussets underneath, and also have no battery on it... just for "looks" if you will. I have a ton of different weld on gussets laying around from doing chassis fab. on various racecars ive worked on. On the 66' I just bought though, I have to disagree, I mean I would normally have no quarrel at all with making my own battery holder/tray/etc... without caring about what it looked like, but after dis-assembling and thoroughly looking over this scr, inside and out if you will... I have almost every single piece needed to restore it to exact oem condition, (including the 6v 7ah battery) other that the battery tray/plate. So it just doesnt seem to make sense to not fix this and make it a full concourse restoration. Im still hoping someone out there, or on here can find some time to send me more pics, measurements, etc... if i have an accurate picture, and the measurements i am positive i could fab. one that no-one would ever be able to tell wasnt factory installed... I am also not a slouch on the drafting table, I have never really used cad programs, but I can do it the old fashioned way. So if someone can give me the info i need I can produce scale mechanical drawings, and post them on here, for others to use in the future to fabricate their own tray.

Joe
Too many projects to list...
12 Ducati singles currently

DewCatTea-Bob
Posts: 2897
Joined: Sun Nov 01, 2009 10:53 am
Location: Near SE side of Lake Michigan

Late-narrowcase Battery-box Reconstruction

Postby DewCatTea-Bob » Fri Aug 05, 2011 7:23 pm

" On the 66' I just bought though, I have to disagree, I mean I would normally have no quarrel at all with making my own battery holder/tray/etc... without caring about what it looked like, but after dis-assembling and thoroughly looking over this scr, inside and out if you will... I have almost every single piece needed to restore it to exact oem condition, (including the 6v 7ah battery) other that the battery tray/plate. So it just doesnt seem to make sense to not fix this and make it a full concourse restoration. "

____ I understand that mind-set (these days), although I-myself have never gotten out of the common mind-set from back in the days when everyone was looking to adapt modifications that actually provide useful improvements.


" if i have an accurate picture, and the measurements i am positive i could fab. one that no-one would ever be able to tell wasnt factory installed... "

____ Since it's a very uncommon b.platform, I'm pretty sure you're right about being able to fool most others, but since you don't have on-hand an exact-copy to directly-guide you, your imitation will quite likely include telltale-signs which will still allow for detection as not being originally factory-done. _ And that being the case, I suggest up-scaling it in size somewhat, so that you could then fit a larger & more common battery, when finally desired.


Hopeful-Cheers,
-Bob
PLEASE NOTE... If this-post is not-yet signed-off with '-Bob', then I'm still in the process of completing it,, and if not also included with 'DCT' near bottom as well, then I may edit this post's wording at a later time. - Dct.Bob

kmev
Posts: 91
Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2009 1:55 am
Location: Wisconsin

Re: Late narrowcase battery box

Postby kmev » Tue Aug 09, 2011 3:23 pm

joe46ho wrote:Kmev

Any chance I could persuade you (in your spare time, no rush) to measure all the dimensions of your battery tray for me ? I have run into the same "hacked off tray" problem as you had. But mine is a little worse, I am missing all but about a quarter sized piece of mine...any help would be greatly appreciated...
Joe


Joe,

I only had the verticle plate on my bike when I got it - I got the dimensions of the lower, horizontal plate from ajleone here on the forum. I also made an angled support gusset beneath the tray for reinforcement and a tab for the rear fender that are not according to any spec or pattern.

I never tried ordering the compatible 6v battery number that is listed earlier in this thread, so I don't know if it is still available. Now that I have converted to 12v, I wish I would have taken Bob's advice and made a larger battery tray, as I cannot find anything in 12v that will fit. Needless to say, this tray is going to be cut off and replaced with something more usable.

Here are the dimensions:
Verticle plate: 5.25" tall x 5.0" wide. It is offset so that 3" are to port of the center of the frame tube, and 2" are to starboard. The top of the plate is .75" from the frame tube, while the bottom is touching the frame tube (this make the plate verticle, or nearly so, while the frame tube is angled).

Horizontal plate: 5.0" wide x 2.0" long. The 2.0" is measured inside the 90 degree angles. I don't recall making the tabs to any specific pattern but the side tabs are 1.0" wide by 3/8" tall and centered. The aft tab is the full width and also 3/8" tall.

Let me know if you need anything else.

Keith


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